Harry HILDITCH

[fionajka]

Hi Lizzie,

His marriage certificate does indeed give fathers name as John HILDITCH, which leads me to believe that the Julia Hilditch found on the 1881 census wouldn't be his mother, especially if this is her maiden name, as she is listed as single...she may be John's sister.

I agree that his birth certificate is the key but I first need to narrow down which of the three listed are him... although the Stone one is most probable due to ages on marriage cert and 1891 census. I'm not going to believe the IGI birth information yet until I find more proof to corroborate it.

I think that the 1891 census which Harry is listed with Hilditch grandparents could possibly be the parents of his father John, not Julia (unless she is John sister), as was first suggested. So maybe a look for a John Hilditch with those parents would be an idea - Harry is born c 1876, according to his marriage age, so John possibly born around 1846-1856. So if anyone has access to the 1851/61 census then a look for him would be appreciated

I couldn't find a marriage for John yet either, but I do know he was deceased by 1906 - Harry's marriage. I haven't been able to find that either as yet.

So where do we go from here...?

Fiona

[welsh lady]

1851 census
Haslington,Cheshire
H0107 Piece 2169 Folio 200

George Hilditch,Head,27,Farm Lab,Barthomly? Cheshire
Ann Hilditch,Wife,23,Alsagar,Cheshire
John Hilditch,Son,3,Alsagar Cheshire
Thomas Hilditch,Son,8m,Haslington

This corresponds with the 1891 census found above when Harrys with his Grandparents.So they were Johns parents

Welsh Lady

[Annette7]

Have been following these recent posts and have done some checking re. John Hilditch bc.1848 Alsager.

By 1881 he is married to an Ann and living in Haslington, Cheshire with 3 children, none of whom is Harry.   John is a Farmer (in 1901 still a farmer and still married to Ann).
1881 ref. - RG11 - 3544 - 83 - 6.

Hopefully you can get the correct birth certificate.   Alas, the cynic in me still thinks this will show he is the son of just Julia Hilditch.   His father may well have been named John, and a wheelwright, but I don't think he was a Hilditch.   Can find no John Hilditch who is a wheelwright I'm afraid.

Annette

[fionajka]

Hi Annette,

If you can't believe a marriage certificate then what can you believe?! I understand your cynicism though - just need some more proof

I don't know where else to go with this one - don't know how else to narrow down the birth.

Fiona

[Annette7]

Hi Fiona

I'm afraid my cynicism is due to personal experience - have been researching for over 20 years and umpteen times have had certificates which state fathers name/profession when the reality was that they were born 'the wrong side of the blanket' - the one thing they all have in common is that the father is always shown as 'deceased'.   

I feel that the certificate you need is the one born in Sept.qtr. 1876 Stone.   That's what I would get anyway.

Will look forward to reading the outcome.   Fingers crossed it's the right one.

Annette

[fionajka]

So do you think to be respectable, on his marriage certificate he made up the name/occupation etc...?

Just to cross off all doubt, is there a Julia Hilditch in 1861/71 census? with parents same name as 1891 census perhaps....

Fiona

[Annette7]

I do think details were 'made up' to try and put some respectability on themselves.   In some way you can't blame them - they probably grew up with a stigma and now they could put it behind them.

Anyway, in 1871 Julia was working away from home as a servant but she was indeed a daughter of George and Ann as I suspected.   Took me a little while to find them as the surname as been written as Hildiche.

1861 - Close Lane, Haslington, Cheshire

George Hildiche   Head 39     Agricultural Labourer         b. Berchton, Cheshire
Ann Hildiche   Wife     33      Labourer's wife                 b. Alsager, Cheshire
John Hildiche   Son     14      Labourer                                      ditto
Mary Hildiche   Dau.     9       Scholar                            b. Haslington, Cheshire
Henry Hildiche  Son      7           ditto                                         ditto
Julia Hildiche    Dau.      5           ditto                                         ditto
Margaret Hildiche    Dau.     3                                                     ditto
Samuel Hildiche   Son    1                                                           ditto

next door (maybe George's parents)

Ralph Hildiche    Head     60    Agricultural Labour      b. Haslington, Cheshire
Elizabeth Hildiche Wife    65   Labourer's wife            b. Berchton, Cheshire

Ref. RG9 - 2617 - 33 - 8

Annette


                                                                         

[LizzieW]

My g.grandmother was married before she met my g.grandfather.  Her eldest daughter from her first marriage had an illegitimate daughter (E).  (No-one can even find the birth registration).  However, when E married, she gave her father as, believe it or not, John (and the surname) deceased.  Her mother did marry later on, but E did not live with her, she lived with her grandmother and in any case, her mother's husband wasn't called John.  Her grandfather and Uncle were both called John so maybe she just chose that name.    In the same way, Harry may just have given his uncle's name to the registrar.

There are many Hilditch families in Cheshire and Staffordshire, so the other option is that Harry's father was a distant relative of Julia.

Lizzie

[welsh lady]

Yes i agree i have lots of birth certs in my family who were illegitimate who then when married put a made up Fathers name down.John and Julia were brother and sister so Harry could have put the name down for respectability on his marriage cert if Julia was his Mother?
However you cant rule out anything yet until you send for the birth cert.


Good Luck
Welsh Lady