Author Topic: james saunders or saunders-loder  (Read 11656 times)

Offline Loveden

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Re: james saunders or saunders-loder
« Reply #9 on: Thursday 10 May 12 05:54 BST (UK) »
Whitmore,I've been trying to find you for some weeks now!Listen my daughter's mother is a descendant of John Saunders-Loder, Emma's brother.I found your post about your whakapapa and we NEED to dicuss the finer points about.
I await your reply.

naku noa, naa Upokoruru
Alderson Scott -Arkengarthdale, Loveden Boucher & Wakefield -Berkshire, Rawsthorne -Ormskirk, Stanley-Snowshill, Harris-Aston Cantlow, Clemenger-Cavan, Ireland and Liverpool, Metcalf-Kirkby Stephen, Bishop-Trowbridge.

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Offline Loveden

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Re: james saunders or saunders-loder
« Reply #10 on: Thursday 10 May 12 06:05 BST (UK) »
I am also open to discuss with any one regarding Jimmy the Needle's first wife, Pere Kapu, the daughter of Peneamine Te Kihi and Romia and aspects about the relevant whakapapa that goes back from Peneamine Te Kihi including the Land Court minutes of 1967 in relation to Tanihera Teko/Reko.
Alderson Scott -Arkengarthdale, Loveden Boucher & Wakefield -Berkshire, Rawsthorne -Ormskirk, Stanley-Snowshill, Harris-Aston Cantlow, Clemenger-Cavan, Ireland and Liverpool, Metcalf-Kirkby Stephen, Bishop-Trowbridge.

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Offline Lammerlaw

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Re: james saunders or saunders-loder
« Reply #11 on: Thursday 10 May 12 06:32 BST (UK) »
I am also open to discuss with any one regarding Jimmy the Needle's first wife, Pere Kapu, the daughter of Peneamine Te Kihi and Romia and aspects about the relevant whakapapa that goes back from Peneamine Te Kihi including the Land Court minutes of 1967 in relation to Tanihera Teko/Reko.

Interesting - I have a photo of JSL's daughter on the wall behind me as I type - it was her who told my grandmother (her daughter)  of the money I mentioned earlier.

I have considerable papers relating to JSL but att his point in time am too disorganised to feed the cat let alone look out or sort them out. I am a great great grandson of his.

Offline Loveden

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Re: james saunders or saunders-loder
« Reply #12 on: Thursday 10 May 12 07:19 BST (UK) »
kia ora Lammerlaw,
I have researched a lot of S.Iland Maori history over the years,especially whakapapa.I have traced the whakapapa for Romia, Peneamine Te Kihi's wife, but not any further back for Te Kihi, except what appeared in the Maori Land Court minute book no.42, p.349, in 1967 which was given by Rose Paiki Tumaru ,daughter of Ema Saunders-Loder and Hemi Paiki.Rose gave a whakapapa that placed Peneamine Te Kihi as the son of Tanihera Teko or Reko and Mairaki Punamaru.She claimed Tanihera was her gr.gr.grandmother, although Tanihera is probably the same as 'Taniera', i.e, a S.Island transliteration for the name 'Daniel'!But why does Tanihera have both names ?Teko and Reko?The only Teko I know of was a man lived at the Punamaru nohoaka-settlement in 1848 of the Kati Kura hapu (probably from the tipuna Kuratakiao).The census places Teko's age as 48 ,whilst Peneamine Te Kihi in Waikouaiti was 46.This Teko cannot be Te Kihi's parent.Te Kihi's parents would be born.circa 1780.
Alderson Scott -Arkengarthdale, Loveden Boucher & Wakefield -Berkshire, Rawsthorne -Ormskirk, Stanley-Snowshill, Harris-Aston Cantlow, Clemenger-Cavan, Ireland and Liverpool, Metcalf-Kirkby Stephen, Bishop-Trowbridge.

Offline Loveden

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Re: james saunders or saunders-loder
« Reply #13 on: Thursday 10 May 12 07:23 BST (UK) »
p.s: feed the moggy. ;)
Alderson Scott -Arkengarthdale, Loveden Boucher & Wakefield -Berkshire, Rawsthorne -Ormskirk, Stanley-Snowshill, Harris-Aston Cantlow, Clemenger-Cavan, Ireland and Liverpool, Metcalf-Kirkby Stephen, Bishop-Trowbridge.

Offline Lammerlaw

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Re: james saunders or saunders-loder
« Reply #14 on: Thursday 10 May 12 07:50 BST (UK) »
kia ora Lammerlaw,
I have researched a lot of S.Iland Maori history over the years,especially whakapapa.I have traced the whakapapa for Romia, Peneamine Te Kihi's wife, but not any further back for Te Kihi, except what appeared in the Maori Land Court minute book no.42, p.349, in 1967 which was given by Rose Paiki Tumaru ,daughter of Ema Saunders-Loder and Hemi Paiki.Rose gave a whakapapa that placed Peneamine Te Kihi as the son of Tanihera Teko or Reko and Mairaki Punamaru.She claimed Tanihera was her gr.gr.grandmother, although Tanihera is probably the same as 'Taniera', i.e, a S.Island transliteration for the name 'Daniel'!But why does Tanihera have both names ?Teko and Reko?The only Teko I know of was a man lived at the Punamaru nohoaka-settlement in 1848 of the Kati Kura hapu (probably from the tipuna Kuratakiao).The census places Teko's age as 48 ,whilst Peneamine Te Kihi in Waikouaiti was 46.This Teko cannot be Te Kihi's parent.Te Kihi's parents would be born.circa 1780.

At this point I think that the line in question comes to an end at Teko and Mairaki Punaomaru - at a cursory glance that is as far back as I have. For the other members of my Family, Hape and Ripeka Korako I can go back as far as it goes.

Your queries re ages etc and who is whos parent I cannot try to work out at the moment. I have dozens of pages of whakapapa BUT I gave up on it twenty years ago as I was tearing my hair out trying to fathom it out then decided that it could wait and it is still waiting.

Offline Loveden

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Re: james saunders or saunders-loder
« Reply #15 on: Thursday 10 May 12 08:48 BST (UK) »
so Lammerlaw, do you come down the Paiki side from Ema?I  found some whakapapa for Paiki's father and mother, Hemi Hape and Erihapeti/Elizabeth.Not sure how reliable it is.Needs to be cross checked.
I wanted to contact Whitmore, because she (?) posted a whakapapa on the internet way back in 2001 which appears to connect to Reko, son of Te Pananehu, and someone called Mairaki.Te Pananehu and Reko are my tipuna, but the lines Whitmore showed are new to me, but of great interest.
Alderson Scott -Arkengarthdale, Loveden Boucher & Wakefield -Berkshire, Rawsthorne -Ormskirk, Stanley-Snowshill, Harris-Aston Cantlow, Clemenger-Cavan, Ireland and Liverpool, Metcalf-Kirkby Stephen, Bishop-Trowbridge.

Offline Lammerlaw

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Re: james saunders or saunders-loder
« Reply #16 on: Thursday 10 May 12 09:03 BST (UK) »
so Lammerlaw, do you come down the Paiki side from Ema?I  found some whakapapa for Paiki's father and mother, Hemi Hape and Erihapeti/Elizabeth.Not sure how reliable it is.Needs to be cross checked.
I wanted to contact Whitmore, because she (?) posted a whakapapa on the internet way back in 2001 which appears to connect to Reko, son of Te Pananehu, and someone called Mairaki.Te Pananehu and Reko are my tipuna, but the lines Whitmore showed are new to me, but of great interest.

I have many pages of the Hemi Paiki whakapapa but the only small link I have not got is the connection with Korako of Murderering beach if it exists and according to my grandmother 'that was my line' - Hemi Hape came from the same line as Tikaos and Irahapetis mother was Ripeka Korako. Yes the Paiki line is my line.

Offline Loveden

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Re: james saunders or saunders-loder
« Reply #17 on: Thursday 10 May 12 09:45 BST (UK) »
so Lammerlaw, do you come down the Paiki side from Ema?I  found some whakapapa for Paiki's father and mother, Hemi Hape and Erihapeti/Elizabeth.Not sure how reliable it is.Needs to be cross checked.
I wanted to contact Whitmore, because she (?) posted a whakapapa on the internet way back in 2001 which appears to connect to Reko, son of Te Pananehu, and someone called Mairaki.Te Pananehu and Reko are my tipuna, but the lines Whitmore showed are new to me, but of great interest.

I have many pages of the Hemi Paiki whakapapa but the only small link I have not got is the connection with Korako of Murderering beach if it exists and according to my grandmother 'that was my line' - Hemi Hape came from the same line as Tikaos and Irahapetis mother was Ripeka Korako. Yes the Paiki line is my line.

I was looking through Hemi Paiki's notebook toady at the Hocken library.It was dated 1883 and includes the years of births for the Heath children.Awhile back I also read Beattie's interviews with Rose Violet Paiki and Hana Paiki and their anecdote about Peneamine Te Kihi and his son burying 'paiwhenua' somewhere near Morven.My gr.gr.grandfather, Puao Rakiraki, told Beattie that Te Kihi was his father's cousin and that he buried some pounamu up Waimate way.Problem is there was two men called Te Kihi.one was named Horomona Te Kihi and lived on Ruapuke Island and sometimes at Port Molyneux-Kaka Point, but this Horomona Te Kihi was said to be an old man" in 1856.His wife was Te Kawewhitau, a sister of Whakahopu I think.He died about 1863 (?).Puao's father was Haimona Rakiraki/Rakitapu and he was born about 1810.His father was Reko (son of Te Pananehu).These people came from the Waitaki area.Te Kapa was Haimona's uncle and Huruhuru his cousin.
Alderson Scott -Arkengarthdale, Loveden Boucher & Wakefield -Berkshire, Rawsthorne -Ormskirk, Stanley-Snowshill, Harris-Aston Cantlow, Clemenger-Cavan, Ireland and Liverpool, Metcalf-Kirkby Stephen, Bishop-Trowbridge.