Author Topic: Lost at Sea  (Read 4443 times)

Offline TeddyEdward

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Lost at Sea
« on: Wednesday 25 February 09 21:22 GMT (UK) »
My Grandfather (Stephen Henry Sharpe No5329589 CSM for the 2nd Bn Royal Berkshire regiment) was travelling back from India in the Autumn of 1939 with my Granmother and 6 children, one of which was my father (now deceased).  They travelled by train from Lucknow to Bombay where they boarded HM Troopship Nevasa and sailed to Mombasa.  I have a printed card showing there position on the 4th of Sept 1939, 103 mile short of the equator. 

They transfered to another ship probably in Mombasa and on the 19th Oct at 19:30 hours there was a "large thud and bump" and in the confusion life boats where launched and 3 of the children were drowned and a man (J Clarke) in attempting to rescue what was believed to be a small child was washed overboard and also drowned.

As far as I can tell from my grandfathers hand written account of the event the ship had not been in any danger.

What I am trying to find is the name of the ship (Saga......? ) and the official record of the event to establish what happened and the names of the lost souls. 

How would I go about this?


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Offline neil1821

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Re: Lost at Sea
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 25 February 09 21:38 GMT (UK) »
Welcome to Rootschat!  :)

Death certificates are available from the GRO Marine Deaths Indices 1903-1965
I've attached the relevant part of the index for you.
So Ronald, John and Edward, aged 10, 9 and 1 respectively.
And the vessel is the "Sagaing"
The last column refers to page number.


Name interests: Boulton, Murrell, Lock, Croxton, Skinner, Blewett, Tonkin, Trathen.
Military History & Medals

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Offline neil1821

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Re: Lost at Sea
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 25 February 09 21:40 GMT (UK) »
And the same index also confirms the death of Joseph Clarke age 22, also on the "Sagaing"
Name interests: Boulton, Murrell, Lock, Croxton, Skinner, Blewett, Tonkin, Trathen.
Military History & Medals

Offline liverpool annie

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Re: Lost at Sea
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 25 February 09 22:00 GMT (UK) »


Hi Teddy !

I just found a snippet  .... not much I'm afraid ...

NAVAL EVENTS OCTOBER 1939 Wednesday, 18 October

In submarine operations against convoy HG.3, steamers SAGAING (7968grt), GARBRATTAN (1811grt), CITY OF GUILDFORD (5157grt) and CLAN MCBEAN (5000grt) reported they were attacked on the 18th but undamaged. Destroyer ESCORT joined SAGAING and escorted her from the area.

http://www.naval-history.net/xDKWW2-3910-07OCT02.htm
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Offline neil1821

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Re: Lost at Sea
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 25 February 09 22:04 GMT (UK) »
Name interests: Boulton, Murrell, Lock, Croxton, Skinner, Blewett, Tonkin, Trathen.
Military History & Medals

Offline neil1821

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Re: Lost at Sea
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 25 February 09 22:16 GMT (UK) »
Another thing that might give you some clues is the movement card for SS Sagaing. It won't tell you details of any passengers, but it will tell you where the ship was sailing from, where going to, etc.

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documentsonline/bt389.asp
Name interests: Boulton, Murrell, Lock, Croxton, Skinner, Blewett, Tonkin, Trathen.
Military History & Medals

Offline liverpool annie

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Re: Lost at Sea
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 25 February 09 22:30 GMT (UK) »

Well this was her route in 1934-35 ... can't find one for later !

Sailings July 1934-June 1935

Liverpool, Gibraltar, Marseilles, Port Said, Port Sudan, Rangoon

http://www.timetableimages.com/maritime/images/hender.htm

Theres a way of finding out about the convoy here ... but I can't work it out ... can anybody else ??

http://www.convoyweb.org.uk/index.html
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Offline neil1821

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Re: Lost at Sea
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 25 February 09 23:18 GMT (UK) »
Good site that last one Annie  :)

We can start recreating the ship's movements.

Nevasa (the other ship the original poster mentioned) left Mombasa independently on 20 Sept 1939 and arrived at Suez on 29 Sept. After transiting the Suez canal it reached Port Said the next day, 30th.
No movements recorded (on that site anyway) for the Sagaing in September.

Then 1-11 Oct 1939 Sagaing and Nevasa were in Convoy Blue3 from Port Said to Gibraltar
http://www.convoyweb.org.uk/misc/index.html?yy.php?convoy=BLUE.3

13-21 Oct 1939 Sagaing joined the onward Convoy HG3 to Liverpool
So when tragedy struck on 19th Oct they were only 2 days out of Liverpool and approaching home waters.
http://www.convoyweb.org.uk/hg/index.html?hg.php?convoy=3

The Sharpe family could have transferred from Nevasa to Sagaing in Port Said or Gibraltar.
Name interests: Boulton, Murrell, Lock, Croxton, Skinner, Blewett, Tonkin, Trathen.
Military History & Medals

Offline liverpool annie

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Re: Lost at Sea
« Reply #8 on: Wednesday 25 February 09 23:26 GMT (UK) »


I spend over an hour on that site Neil ... and ended up throwing up my hands !!  ::)

I knew somebody smarter than me would be able to work it out !  :D

I knew it was a good site ... I just couldn't work it !!

So you think they were only two days out ? ...... can't find a report of the loss of lives yet - but I'm still looking !

Annie  :)
Cooper : Muels : Howarth : Every : Price : King

http://web.archive.org/web/20130407030702/http://www.freewebs.com/liverpoolannie

http://web.archive.org/web/20130407191115/http://manchestersoldiers.webs.com

http://web.archive.org/web/20130807102055/http://www.powv.webs.com/
Be who you are and say what you feel -  because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind ! Dr. Seuss

Erect no gravestone .... let the Rose every year bloom for his sake ! Rilke Sonnets to Orpheus, I