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Author Topic: 39th Regiment of Foot  (Read 11023 times)

Offline MaureenM

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Re: 39th Regiment of Foot
« Reply #18 on: Tuesday 28 September 10 09:38 BST (UK) »
Thank you Ken for such a swift reply. 

Would any records show if a wife accompanied a major, firstly to New South Wales and then  on to India?
Maureen
Poole family in the army 1780 - 1890
Spence family in Chester

Offline km1971

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Re: 39th Regiment of Foot
« Reply #19 on: Tuesday 28 September 10 09:47 BST (UK) »
Hi Maureen

No, army records do not include details of families until much later, and even then they are only the married roll for the rank & file. However, most officer's wives would travel with their husbands. The problem is proving it. They used RN ships so there are no passenger lists. You could check the regimental BMDs on sites such as Findmypast in case any children are listed. It should have his regiment in the index.

Ken



Offline Broomie

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Re: 39th Regiment of Foot
« Reply #20 on: Tuesday 28 September 10 11:54 BST (UK) »
Hi Maureen,
I can add a little on Major Poole's later activities. I researched the Coorg campaign earlier in the year to find out what happened to Captain Forbes of the 39th who wrote the diary of the Voyage of the Guildford, referred to in my previous post.

By the time Poole received his appointment to the 39th on Feb 21, 1828, most of the 39th's complement were already in NSW. Their headquarters had been transferred the previous year.  Presumably Major Poole was a later arrival. Unless the Sydney Gazette reported his arrival, I can't add to what Ken said. Ironically, detailed records exist for convict arrivals but not for the military.

 A google search will give you a fair bit of information on the 39th's activities in NSW but I haven't noticed anything on Major Poole.

On the transfer of the regiment to India: six companies of the regiment embarked at Sydney on the 21st of July 1832, in three divisions, and disembarked at Madras on the 22nd of September and the 10th and 14th of October.  The remaining four companies embarked at Sydney on the 3rd of December, and arrived at Madras on the 21st of February of the following year. On arrival they marched the 13 miles from Madras to Poonamalee where they were stationed.They next marched to Bangalore in February 1833. In the following month cholera broke out amongst the troops and they suffered a heavy death toll. In the course of five weeks the regiment lost their adjutant, Captain Thomas Meyrick, four serjeants, forty-two rank and file, two women, and eleven children.

The Coorg campaign is well documented and I recommend these sites (if you haven't already found them)

http://newspapers.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/2217218
 
http://malabardays.blogspot.com/2010/03/outbreak-of-war-with-coorg-1834.html

As you'll see, Colonel Lindesay praised his infantry commander, Major Poole, very highly. (Forbes, who appears to have acted as Lindesay's personal assistant, also gets a very favourable mention). This campaign would have been quite profitable to Major Poole.

Captain Forbes became the secretary of the Coorg Prize Committee and their nominated agent. Following normal procedure, this was set up to organise the distribution of twenty-nine thousand pounds in prize money derived from the sale of plunder. Over nine thousand would go to Colonel Lindesay with the remainder distributed amongst the lesser ranks. Even the dead received their share although it might be slow in coming. The widow and son of Private Bennett of the 39th had to wait twenty years to receive his four pounds nine shillings share.

Forbes didn't live to enjoy his share either. He left a final diary, a private log kept between 10th April and 12th June, 1836, of his voyage on SS Protector en route from Madras to Gravesend. He was in command of a group of soldiers who, like himself, were being invalided back to Britain. Reportedly the diary tells us that he boarded the ship for home “more dead than alive”. On June 16 he died and was buried at sea. At the time of his death the prize money still hadn't been distributed: he bequeathed the monies he expected to receive to his relations. I hope Major Poole derived more benefit from his share.
 
I can't help much with the remaining years. After the Coorg victory they were highly praised. They remained camped at Mercara, the capital of the Coorg region until mid-1834 then marched back to Bangalore. In late 1838 and early 1839 they marched the 160 miles to Bellara to replace the 41st Regiment. It was there that Major Poole died. The United Services Magazine of 1839 lists his death at Bellara, Madras on April, 23, 1839. Have you found how he died?

The story behind his reference to Mary as a "worthless wretch" would be very interesting. I googled Thomas Poole out of interest and saw that Mary was the youngest child of the (then) wealthy Freeman-Deane family of Castle Cor in County Cork. After such a noble upbringing she might have let her self go a bit! It would be interesting to hear her side of the story.

Just let me know if you want further information on my sources etc. Hope this is of some use.
Cheers, Doug.



Offline MaureenM

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Re: 39th Regiment of Foot
« Reply #21 on: Tuesday 28 September 10 18:00 BST (UK) »
Wow - what a lot to absorb.  Thank you very much.

I have spent a lot of today looking into the Coorg campaign but had not got all the wonderful detail you have  come up with.
Another descendent has also been looking at this relative and she gave me the newspaper reference today too!

She found out that his death was   due to cholera - on 23 rd April and the date for sailing from Sydney to Madras on the Hercules 9th Dec 1832
where did you get the wife Mary ?    Do you think she went native/had an affair or took to drink?
We have not found where Thomas was born yet.
A brother John Poole, about 10 yrs younger had a similar good career in 22nd regiment of Foot. Ending his career as Colonel.
Maureen
Poole family in the army 1780 - 1890
Spence family in Chester

Offline Broomie

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Re: 39th Regiment of Foot
« Reply #22 on: Tuesday 28 September 10 22:20 BST (UK) »
Hi Maureen,
Sounds like you're having a lot of fun with it. A couple of corrections: I referred to "Major Poole" when referring to his death but by then of course he'd been promoted to Lt Col. There's bound to be some reference to the promotion to tell you when it happened. Also Mary's family was Deane-Freeman not the other way around as I had it. Google them and you'll find a history of the family. My guess on Mary's wretched worthlessness would be an affair and a return to Britain in disgrace. India was very hard on wives with heat & dust & boredom & lots of dashing young officers looking to practise their "gallantry" on them. And Mary was probably younger and the Colonel was away a lot etc etc. Of course she might have simply been an independant spirit and not content to be treated like one of the rank & file of the 39th. Her family were renouned for their kindness and generosity. It's hard to believe that they'd have produced a "worthless wretch". It would be interesting to find out what really happened.
 On Thomas's birth, Ireland is a possibility, specifically County Cork. That's where Mary came from. However, I vaguely remember a reference to a Thomas Poole in the Cork Militia in the early 1800s, maybe something he joined in his early years. It was a common enough name so it's only a vague possibility. Good luck with it.
Doug

Offline MaureenM

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Re: 39th Regiment of Foot
« Reply #23 on: Wednesday 29 September 10 00:03 BST (UK) »
Hi,

The London Gazette is good for military promotions so I have the dates for Thomas at each stage.  His first appearance is as Ensign in 22nd (not purchased) 1805, which seemed to suggest a Cheshire birth; transfer to the 39th in 1828 at the rank of major. Then off to the penal colony in Sydney before India.

I am waiting for the archivist at Chester to look into their records for more information on his origins.

Maureen
Poole family in the army 1780 - 1890
Spence family in Chester

Offline km1971

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Re: 39th Regiment of Foot
« Reply #24 on: Wednesday 29 September 10 09:41 BST (UK) »
Hi Maureen

You cannot assume he was born in Cheshire because of the nominal name of the 22nd Foot. He could have come from anywhere. Less than 10% of rank and file enlisting in the 'Cheshires' around that time, were born in Cheshire.

As he was an officer the museum should have something. Although I doubt they will have his place of birth. As he did not purchase his commission there is a chance he had previous military experience so you should follow up Doug's Militia suggestion. He is less likely to have come from the ranks of the 22nd Foot - although it would help if you gave an indication of his age in say 1805.

A Thomas Poole enlisted in the 22nd Regiment in 1799, but he was still rank and file when he was discharged in 1820.

Ken

Offline MaureenM

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Re: 39th Regiment of Foot
« Reply #25 on: Wednesday 29 September 10 10:42 BST (UK) »
Ah - Thomas Poole's age is a mystery as we have no birth, death, marriage certificates.
My best chance is the museum at the moment. But Ireland does sound a good bet. His friends in 1838 when writing his will were John O'Neill and sister Georgiana O'Neill who were given guardianship of a young daughter.

But the search is proving so interesting - I thought coming up with another g g g g grandfather who was a Hull whaling captain of 1820 was exciting enough but this is even better.
M
Poole family in the army 1780 - 1890
Spence family in Chester

Offline MaureenM

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Re: 39th Regiment of Foot
« Reply #26 on: Wednesday 29 September 10 15:29 BST (UK) »
More from my other online friend re Thomas Poole

 
Fantastic detail in the information from your correspondent!  This is getting more and more interesting and each email from you stimulates me to do some more digging.
 
The reference to Mary Deane-Freeman says she married Major Thomas Poole of the 39th, so this must have pre-dated his promotion to Lt-Col.

ie between 14th Feb 1828 and 10 Jan 1837
 
Mary Poole relict of Lt-Col. Thomas Poole died in Ireland (probably Cork) 25th March 1859.  So she went back home and did not remarry.

Mary was the second wife of Thomas Poole

 
On a link to families in India website from the second ref below, I found that Thomas left Deptford on the Sophia for NSW on 1st July 1828 with 13 men.  So, as Doug says, he was following the rest of the regiment, who had already left.
 
I also found a Lt O’Neill and Miss O’Neill arriving in Madras from London on Seostris via Portsmouth, Madeira and The Cape.  Date is 19th August 1835, but it’s not clear if this was departure or arrival.  Also Georgiana O’Neill died 1910 in Bombay (possibly the right person but she would have been an elderly spinster).
 
The O'Neill's come into the story when they are appointed guardians of  a young daughter Georgiana in 1838 after Mary Poole is described as  a worthless wretch in a codicil to the will

I like the suggestion the Thomas Poole was from Ireland.  Mary’s family were Anglo-Irish and there were certainly wealthy Pooles living in Cork as well.  Apparently army officers from Ireland would have been wealthy protestant landowners.  If this is correct then it looks possible that he met and married Sarah Spence when he was posted to Hull and you need to look for their marriage there.

Sarah Spence is the first wife and my direct ancestor. We can only place her in Mauritius 1816b /17 while the 22nd Foot were there as 2 daughters were born there and in Hull in 1822 for the birth of the third daughter. No birth, death  or marriage record has been uncovered yet - perhaps we ar elookin gin the wrong places.

 
The trouble with Irish ancestry is that it’s difficult to research.
Poole family in the army 1780 - 1890
Spence family in Chester