Author Topic: Looking for information on James Whitecross born 1841 in Aberdeenshire.  (Read 12652 times)

Offline flst

  • RootsChat Moderator
  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ********
  • Posts: 1,781
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Looking for information on James Whitecross born 1841 in Aberdeenshire.
« Reply #54 on: Wednesday 30 December 09 22:50 GMT (UK) »
Hi Gadget,
I haven't come across another Alexander in the1851 census but that may be because I was searching in freecen & it's incomplete.
Regarding  Thomas L Whitecross, he is in England in 1861,aged 26, a servant,born in Aberdeen. I have n't access to this census just found this info in familysearch.
flst
TAYLOR, COBBAN, SCOTT, PATERSON, BARCLAY,  DUNCAN, SKENE, SIM, WOOD, STEPHEN, ROSE,  CUMINE, MORISON, GERRARD, PYPER, ANDERSON,  FARQUHAR, BURNET, THOMSON, DAVIDSON, BIRNIE,  STRACHAN, DEY, GERRIE, ROBERTSON, FINNIE, WYLLIE,STEPHEN,WILLOX,MICHIE,MARR,BRUCE, CLUBB,SLESSOR,CLARK, SIMPSON,HEPBURN,SINCLAIR,BEEDIE,FOWLIE, CLYNE,FINDLATER, JOHNSTON,BROCKIE,PARK, WATT,MACKIE,WALKER,YEATS,THIRD, BURD,EWAN,ARTHUR,AUCKLAND, MURDOCH,LOW, IRVINE,CHALMERS,BOYES, LYON,SMITH,ADIE, WATSON - ALL N.E.SCOTLAND.

RootsChat is the busiest, largest free family history forum site in the country. It is completely free to use. Register now.
Also register instantly with Facebook or Twitter (and other social networks). Start your genealogy search now.


Offline Gadget

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 45,163
  • MEM 1878 - 1949
    • View Profile
Re: Looking for information on James Whitecross born 1841 in Aberdeenshire.
« Reply #55 on: Wednesday 30 December 09 22:55 GMT (UK) »
Just finished searching the 1851 for Scotland and don't see  Alexander.

Gadget
Census &  BMD information Crown Copyright www.nationalarchives.gov.uk and GROS - www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk

RootsChat is the busiest, largest free family history forum site in the country. It is completely free to use. Register now.
Also register instantly with Facebook or Twitter (and other social networks). Start your genealogy search now.


Offline Annette7

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 5,950
    • View Profile
Re: Looking for information on James Whitecross born 1841 in Aberdeenshire.
« Reply #56 on: Thursday 31 December 09 18:13 GMT (UK) »
Hi

Been doing a lot of digging and have come up with a lot of answers I think to questions already raised.   Have tried to list in a logical fashion but this will be a long message.

1. Were Francis Whitecross parents' David Whitecross and Jean Lindsay - Yes!
Francis bp.16/5/1820 Kirriemuir with parents above (have looked at original entry as IGI shows a submitted entry for a Frances, dau. of above with a year of 1819 but it was definitely 1820 and none of the entries states son/daughter, just christian name of child and clearly Frances should read Francis.)   his siblings are (as shown on original and not the submitted ones on IGI) Margaret bp.9/5/1802, Anne bp.22/10/1803, Betty bp.13/10/1805, James bp.30/8/1807, Janet bp.8/10/1809, David bp.15/9/1811, William bp.7/11/1814, Jean bp.3/12/1815, Elizabeth bp.28/3/1818, Francis bp.16/5/1820 and Alexander Lindsay bc.1823/4 (no baptism found).

2. As detailed on the 'freepages' referred to by  'flst' - were William Whytcross bc.1814 and Alexander Lindsay Whitecross bc.1824 brothers who went to Australia - Yes!

3. 1841 Census - Dundee, Angus - Alexander 16 Farm Servant is living with his brother Frances (spelt this way again) - already listed on this thread.

4. William/wife and Alexander sailed to Australia on 21/12/1841 from Greenock arriving Port Philip on 16/2/1842 - William 27, Labourer and Alexander 18 Farm Servant.   Further details of their life in Australia on the 'freepages'.

5. 1861 census - Francis 40  - Labourer in Foundry - living in Perth with an Ann (shown as wife?) 28 and  and son William 17 from marriage to Helen.    Said Helen, clearly abandoned by Francis, is living in Dundee as a Mill Worker with children David 15, Helen 13, and Margaret 8 + a lodger - the 2 elder children also Mill Workers.

6. No death entry can be found in Scotland for Francis Whitehead nor any further trace on census.   Why?   He went to America with Ann!!!

7. Census records in US show he apparently emigrated c.1864 (stated on 1880 and 1900 census) but must have gone back to Scotland for a time returning 28/11/1879. In the US records his age fluctuates alarmingly although it is clearly the same person.   When he arrived back in US in 1879 aged shown as 48 (?) with Mrs. Whitecross (age illegible), a dau. aged 17 (later shown as Bella) and a son Robert aged 6.   Both these children born Scotland, the dau. c.1862 (just before he left) and the son c.1874 (once he'd returned).

8. Can find no trace of these childrens births in Scotland under Whitecross so as we know parents weren't married are they listed under Ann's maiden name which of course we don't know?

9. In 1885 family went from New Jersey to Alabama but had returned by early 1890's.

10. US Census 1880 - Paterson, Passaic, New Jersey
 Whitecross Frances   60      At Home                 b. Scotland
 Whitecross Ann          58 (? - should be 48) Keeps House and Salloon     B. Scotland
 Whitecross Robert      6       At School               b. Scotland
 + 5 Boarders (cannot find dau.)

     US Census 1900 - Paterson Ward 7, Passaic, New Jersey
  Fra. Whitecross    70 (!)     Saloonkeeper         b. Scotland
  Maggie Whitecross 38                                      b. Scotland
  Alexander Black step-son  16                                ditto
  May/Mary (?) Black  step-dau.  12                          ditto

So Ann has died between 1880 and 1893.   1900 Census states Francis and Maggie had been married 7 years.   Son Robert now married with own family.

 11. By 1910 Maggie is a widow again i.e. Frances Whitecross died between 1900 and 1910.   Heaven know what age is given - the only correct one I found was that for 1880 Census.

Annette
     
     
   

Scopes (One-Name Study - Worldwide)
Suffolk - Grist, Knights, Bullenthorpe, Watcham
Scotland - Spence, Horne, Cowan, Moffat
London -  Monk

Don't walk behind me, I may not lead.   Don't walk in front of me, I may not follow.   Just walk beside me and be my friend.

Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline gratuation

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 346
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Looking for information on James Whitecross born 1841 in Aberdeenshire.
« Reply #57 on: Thursday 31 December 09 18:54 GMT (UK) »
hi Annette,

wow, i dont know what to say. I never thought in a million years i would have such an interesting ancetry.!!!!! Never thought any of my ancestors had been outside good old britain.

Just one thing that is really bothering me, I cant get my head around the fact that ( going back now to james whitecross who started all this born 1841 !!!) On his first marriage he has  francis whitecross down as his dad and then on the second marriage certificate  james  down as the dad. Its definatly the same person ( i i think) eveything else ties in all the names of half syblins etc. Gadget said it may be due to nerves on the wedding day which i can understand. However, three lots of bans were read and they all state james as being the dad. Humm, not sure  what to make of that. Nerves  would account  on the  day but all three occassions he put down james humm. What do you think? Is there anyway i can cross check that james was really francis!!!!?  Hope that all makes sence, i dont like to adopt a family on my tree unless i am 100% sure, you know what i mean.

Thanks for taking the time to look all those records up, i am very impressed.

oh yes can you let me know what this freepages are?  Is there a web page address for it ?

many many thanks

G

Offline Annette7

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 5,950
    • View Profile
Re: Looking for information on James Whitecross born 1841 in Aberdeenshire.
« Reply #58 on: Thursday 31 December 09 19:11 GMT (UK) »
Hi again

In a way I can understand your feelings re. the father James stated on 2nd. marriage but all the evidence points to it actually being Francis.   Luckily, in this case, the name is relatively unusual and we know that the children are correct and that 1st wife Elizabeth died a couple of years before James re-married.   I reckon it was a simple mistake given when initially giving details - no doubt the marriage certificate was produced from this same information.

As to the freepages link - after reading the earlier post I just googled the name Alexander Lindsay Whitecross and the second item was the link needed.   I noted the web address but part seems to be missing and it didn't come up that way.    Just click on the name and it takes you to a personal web page.   I'm going to contact the submitter because I at least have found information which connects the 2 people she is interested in.

At the end of the day, there was no James Whitecross, Iron Moulder, hence your request in the first place and I'm certain Francis is the man you want.

Annette   
Scopes (One-Name Study - Worldwide)
Suffolk - Grist, Knights, Bullenthorpe, Watcham
Scotland - Spence, Horne, Cowan, Moffat
London -  Monk

Don't walk behind me, I may not lead.   Don't walk in front of me, I may not follow.   Just walk beside me and be my friend.

Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Gadget

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 45,163
  • MEM 1878 - 1949
    • View Profile
Re: Looking for information on James Whitecross born 1841 in Aberdeenshire.
« Reply #59 on: Thursday 31 December 09 19:14 GMT (UK) »
You've been really busy, Annette. Well done  :)

No wonder I couldn't find Francis after Helen's death.  He sneaked off to America  :o

Also the Whitecrosses are  listed as Whytecross on SP  ::)

Gadget

PS - I've found numrous examples of father's name been given wrongly on death and marriage certs. It was just a question of finding the first marriage entry. And, as I'd seen a Francis on a Scottish census in my earlier searches, it became obvious.
Census &  BMD information Crown Copyright www.nationalarchives.gov.uk and GROS - www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk

Offline Annette7

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 5,950
    • View Profile
Re: Looking for information on James Whitecross born 1841 in Aberdeenshire.
« Reply #60 on: Thursday 31 December 09 19:19 GMT (UK) »
Gadget

Don't know if you noticed on IGI but to get entries on overall family you have to enter in 3 different surnames (would have thought as they sound the same the connection would have happened automatically as they usually do) i.e. Whitecross, Whytecross and Whytcross.

Annette
Scopes (One-Name Study - Worldwide)
Suffolk - Grist, Knights, Bullenthorpe, Watcham
Scotland - Spence, Horne, Cowan, Moffat
London -  Monk

Don't walk behind me, I may not lead.   Don't walk in front of me, I may not follow.   Just walk beside me and be my friend.

Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline gratuation

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 346
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Looking for information on James Whitecross born 1841 in Aberdeenshire.
« Reply #61 on: Thursday 31 December 09 19:22 GMT (UK) »
hello again,

yes you are absoulutly right,  cant tell you how very grateful i am that you have taken the time to look this up. THANK YOU SO MUCH.

I trust  your expertise, mabye francis hated the name james !! and just said james because thats what folk called him . He could have considered his gggrand -daughter trying to tie everything  together !!

happy new year Annette you are a star. ( still dont know what freepages are can you send me the web page details) thanks

Still cant beleive what you have managed to find, WOW  
G

 

Offline gratuation

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 346
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Looking for information on James Whitecross born 1841 in Aberdeenshire.
« Reply #62 on: Thursday 31 December 09 19:27 GMT (UK) »
A big thank you to Gadget, flst and Annette, happy new year

Cant tell you how very happy I am to find out  the  information  you have  provided.

Many thanks

:)