Kirby in Mayo

[Kirby123]

Hello everyone,
I'm trying to find any information about my ancestors who came from County Mayo and wondered if you might be able to help. My great-great-great grandfather William Kirby (born in about 1833) came to Manchester, England, in the early 1860s. He was a widower when he married here to Ellen Muirhead (from Westmeath) in 1866. He was a labourer, as was his father Patrick Kirby (born about 1813). There is one William Kirby on the Griffiths Valuation (in Addergoole) but I'm doubtful this is him. The only link I have to a place in Mayo is through people William was connected to in Manchester. A girl born in Manchester in 1863 called Catherine Shevnon was godmother to his children and he took her in as his daughter when her father died. Her mother, Mary Shevnon (nee Naven) was listed on the 1861 census as being from Ballintober. William had a nephew called John Hynes, who was born in Manchester in 1870. John's father was called Michael Hynes. He was born in about 1815 and I think possibly came from Skehnagh in Ballintober. He was a widower when he married a Mary Foley (from Galway) in Manchester in 1857 (I think I have found two of his ealier children in the Burriscara parish records - their mother was called Mary Mannion). I'm trying to find William and Patrick's townland, but have not had any success so far. I have not found any Kirby-Naven or Kirby-Hynes marriage records. Does it sound from this that William was from the Ballintober area? These families all lived in nearby streets in Manchester. Any help would be really appreciated and would solve the last piece of a puzzle that I've been trying to complete for 10 years!

[cathaldus]

Hi! Kirby 123,  welcome to RootsChat!   My paternal family hail from Mayo (Ballyhaunis and Swinford)
Have you tried the following web sites:

                               http://www.brs.genealogy.com

and                         mayo.ancestors.com

don't forget you can also go to the 1901 Leitrim and Roscommon census and of course to the 1911 Irish Census.    There is also the LDS (Mormon) site,  giving the "Ireland Civil Registration Indexes 1845 - 1958 -  http://pilot.familysearch.org/records.   Good hunting!

Bill

[Kirby123]

Hi Bill. Thanks very much for the reply. I've checked BRS and the mayo ancestors, but haven't found anything on there as yet. I also checked the civil registers, but not luck. I've not checked Leitrim Rosscommon or the 1911 though so I'll have a look. Thanks again and best wishes, Dean.

[heywood]

Hello and welcome to rootschat 

It's quite a challenge to sort the names out in Manchester let alone in Mayo 
I keep going back to these people and rereading your post to try to link them and spellings and pronunciations don't help, do they?

Re the Hynes/Hines family
I can't see a marriage for Michael to Mary Foley in 1857- do you have the details? Do any witnesses help at all?
I can see one in 1868 to a Mary Phalan.
There is quite a gap between the older Hynes children and John b 1870 and I was thinking they may be the children of a different mother (was she perhaps related to the Kirbys?)
I can only see Catherine Shevnan in the census with the Kirbys in 1871 and I think you have her parents as Thomas and Mary Sheran in 1861? Again, these seem to disappear and there is a William Hines with them who is possibly part of the web.
Is Mary Mean, niece, Catherine's mother?
I am sorry I am just asking questions but I am trying to sort these people to see if there are any connections to be found.

best wishes
heywood

[Kirby123]

Hi Heywood,
Thanks very much for looking into this for me. Yes, looking back at my post, I think I did perhaps overload the info a bit!

Here's what I have so far...

1857 - St Chad's, Manchester. Michael Hinds, 38, widower, labourer, of Hanover Street, married Mary Foley, 20, spinster, also of Hanover Street. Michael's father was Patrick Hinds, also a labourer. Witnesses John McCann and Ann Hinds.

1859 - St Chad's, Manchester. Thomas Shevnan, 22, batchellor, dyer, of Bosdins buildings, married Mary Nadin (Navin/Naven), 19, spinster, of Cock Gates.

1861 Census - As you can see Thomas and Mary Shevnan are living at Bosdin's Buildings with their son, John, nine months. Michael and Mary Hines also live here with their children, as do Patrick Navin and Elizabeth Navin (nee McCann/McGann). Patrick is Mary Shevnan's brother. They are both listed as being from Ballintubber, Mayo. Thomas Shevnan and Michael Hynes are listed as being from Mayo. I can't find William Kirby on the 1861 census.

1863 - Thomas Shevnan died at Manchester workhouse. I think his daughter, Mary, later went to live with William Kirby, who then brought her up as his daughter, which would explain why she is listed as such on the 1871 census.

1866 - St Chad's, Manchester. William Kirby, 32, widower, labourer, of 14 Back Hanover Street, married Ellen Muirhead, 26, spinster, also of 12 Back Hanover Street. The parish register says his father, Patrick, was from Mayo. Witnesses were Robert Foster, of 10 Back Hanover Street and Anna Hines, of 12? Back Hanover Street.

1867 - William Kirby's son Michael is baptised at St Chad's. Godparents Timothy Fraley and Maria Hines.

1869 - William's daughter Mary  is baptised at St Chad's. Godparents Michael Hynes and Maria McGann.

1870 - Michael Hynes and Mary Foley's son John Hynes is baptised at St Chad's. Godparents William Kirby and his wife Ellen Kirby.

1871 Census - I'm still trying to find out who Mary Mean is. Perhaps she is Mary Navin/Naven and its a misspelling. What do you think?

1871+ Catherine Shevnan is godmother to the remaining four of William's children. Michael Hynes is godfather to one of them. John Hynes (the one born in 1870) is living with William on the 1891 census and listed as his nephew.

In answer to your query about Michael Hynes's two older children, I have found Patrick Hynes baptised at Ballintubber/Burriscara in 1843 and Anne Hynes in the same parish in 1846. They both had Winifred Mannion listed as their mother. There's obviously a connection between these families, but I can't tie it down. Perhaps William's first marriage is the key, but I can't find it in Mayo.

What do you think? Hope you can help.
Very best wishes,
Dean.

[heywood]

Hi Dean,
I'm just feeling cross- wrote a reply and lost it! Here it is again.
I do think you have researched the Manchester end really well.
1861- found the Hynes now but can't find the 1857 marriage.
1871- I think that the 'daughter's for Catherine means daughter of Mary ?? niece rather than daughter of William and Ellen. Possibly Mary Mean is misspelling of Nevan etc but why not Shevnan and why is she married? Sadly we will never know.
They do seem to be linked so much to Mayo that you would imagine William hails from there too.
There are Patrick Kirbys in Griffiths- perhaps his father was still alive during the valuation.
There are also some Kirbys in Ballintober parish- can't see any Nevan/Naven etc. though.
It is such an early period that you are after that it will be difficult to research.
I am sorry I can't think of rmuch else at the moment.
good luck
heywood

[heywood]

I looked at some Ballintober records on this site which you probably have already searched.
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~deesegenes/tomar1.htm
There are some marriages (too early for William to be of marriagable age) which have Kirby/Kerby people.
Looking at Griffiths Valuation for e.g. Gorthbawn/ Gortbaun there are Kirbys there too.
However, how you would match them to your families, I don't know.

[Kirby123]

Hi Heywood. Sorry - I've just checked my records. Michael Hines married Mary Foley in 1855, not 1857! Yes, I think too that Mary Naven could be Mary Mean on the census, but I'll never know for sure. If that was the case, it would put William Kirby in Ballintubber, which would be a result. I've looked at the Patrick Kirbys on Giffiths before. Not sure if he'd be on there though, as he was listed as a labourer on William's marriage certificate. (I've always thought it was only for tenants with a set acreage - what do you think?). I've had a look at the other Kirbys in the area using the tithe applotment. No Patrick on there though either. There was a Hynes (no first name) though in Skehanagh, which is in Ballintubber. The two children baptised in Burriscara to Michael Hynes and Winifred Mannion were from Skehanagh, so this could be them. I've checked the records for my Kirbys, but nothing found. I think the only answer might be to go to Dublin for a trawl of the tithes for Patrick Kirby. I'm also trying to see if Catherine Shevnan I mentioned earlier in the post got married, or where she died. The Shevnans also had a son called John, born in 1860, but I don't knowwhat happened to him. Perhaps its just a lost cause, but thanks for all the advice. It's good to share the problem at least!
Very best wishes, Dean.

[heywood]

To be honest, I think you are up against it here but you never know.
Is Catherine referred to as Shevnan when she is the godmother to the children? There are so many possibilities for that name as seen even in the census and BMD records - yet we can't find her 

I'm never sure re who is who in Griffiths but the fact that there are people of the same name in the area, may assist. Mind you, where my father comes from there are Hynes and Sheeran and looking at Griffiths for Ballintober has several names local to my family's place- I suppose it's because they are just Mayo names.
I'm still thinking