Ann Neal - Newbold Verdon b 1834

[tedscout]

I will read all your replies soon - I just want to say thank you and I think we are all related.

[tedscout]

Hi Sarah and Lorraine,

 I my grandfather spoke of his grandfather often.

My grandfather Horace Philip Neal emigrated from England to Australia when he was 80 - I was 18 and although we had wonderful times and shared wonderful family stories I wish I had questioned him more.

He talked about George Bird as a friend - told me the stupid things they did together - never realized they were related.

I found a Zipporah Cosher death in a workhouse in 1884 - I thought this might be Theo. It was not in Liecestershire but it was on a direct rail line. I cannot think that George would send her to a workhouse though.

I never found Benjamin - either as the name Neal or Kenny. I searched for him thinking I might find Ann. Do either of you have anymore information than him in 1891?

So my new dear cousins, thankyou for your efforts in finding our ancestors. Maybe one day we will meet,

Love from Ted

[Lorraine Jones]

Hi, still looking for a burial record for George Neal - I've been to the library today after being told there was a cross in St. John's churchyard in Coleorton for Rebecca Meadows nee Neal, saying 'reunited with her family'.  Apparently there are a number of unmarked burial plots near this.  I think Rebecca may be the daughter of Willoughby Neal, who died in a car accident.  I have found today burial records for Willoughby (in 1928), and his brother Frederick (in 1914), and also for a John Lea Neal, aged 7, in 1927.  These are all in the Coleorton Parish Registers.  But nothing yet for George or Rebecca.  I thought I would try the baptism records and was about to give up but there they all were - baptised 13th April 1889, children of George and Rebecca Neale, Catherine (15), Willoughby (10), Philip (, Fanny Coley (5), John Lea (3), and Frederick.  Father's occupation is given as labourer, living at 'the row of houses by the pond, St. George's [parish].'  They were baptised by William Beresford Beaumont, who was rector of St. Mary's Church, Coleorton.  As the area of Rotton Row, where they were living, was at various times parts of the villages of Coleorton, Whitwick, and Thringstone, I'll look at parish records of surrounding churches as well, to see what I can find.

[Sarah63]

Hi Lorraine and Ted

Lorraine I think you are right about Rebecca Meadows, my mum remembers willoughby's daughters, they used to visit my Nan with their mother after willoughby died. I think Rebbecca died in Dec 1917, there is a death in Ashby for an Ann Rebecca Neal b1849, but I need to send for the death cert to check (I know she was baby used as Ann Rebbecca Coley). The John Lea d1927 aged 7 was the son of John Lea 1885-1967 and my Nan's brother he was known as Jack, all this calling children after parents in some ways helps you confirm things but in others is confusing. The Lea in John Lea is the maiden name of Ann Rebecca Coley's mother Catherine Coley nee Lea. John Lea had another child Vera who also died in childhood in 1922 aged 5. Thanks for all the baptism info. Keep digging 🙂

Ted I've got Ann and Benjamin Neal living as Kennys with a James Kenny in the 1891 census but nothing after that, though I will check again with fresh eyes.

My Nan used to tell us "Mrs Bird stories" when we were little in the 60's she said Mrs Bird was a relative but I'm not sure of the actual connection. My Nan, Mary Rebbeca and her father John Lea Neal both had red hair and Mrs Bird would tease my Nan that her mother had left her out I the rain and she'd gone rusty! Both my mum, my sister and I have red hair do found these stories funny, my daughter also has red hair, do either of you have red hair in the family? My Nan always said it came down the Coley side.

I'm off to do more hunting, I envy you Lorraine being so local to it all, I'm not far away in Birmingham but somehow there's never time for me to spend a day trawling round grave yards/record offices.
Take care both
Sarah

[Sarah63]

Hi Trisha and Lorraine
I think I've found Theophilia Neal on the 1851 census!!
I'd got her on the 1841 census as Theodica Crosher living with son William Neal in Newbold Verdon and on the 1861 census as Theophia Chrashaw living with her daughter Ann Spencer but had given up looking on the 1851 census.
Anyway went back to basics and searched for anyone living in Leic born in Desford around 1769 and amongst the results was a Felos Evoshew living in Newbold Verdon. That cannot even be a name I thought! When I look at the record I think it's Felas Croshaw so could Felas be a spelling for philia? And Croshaw a spelling for Crosher? I'm thinking yes, based on an ancestry course I've completed which covered spelling names as they sounded and based on different accents etc. Anyway I had to tell someone who might be interested as I'm struggling to get my lot to grasp how exciting it is having a break through when you've hit a brick wall! Hope you're both well
S X

[Lorraine Jones]

This is really interesting - very possible it could be her, particularly being in Newbold Verdon.  Is she living with anyone else, or are there address details for Newbold Verdon?  Well done you - persistence does pay off!  I know that only too rare feeling when you find something exciting, having spent many many hours going through records and finding nothing.  Trouble is, once you're addicted, you really can't stop!  Best wishes, and thanks for keeping us updated.

[Sarah63]

She's living on her own - no address noted and is listed as a pauper

[Lorraine Jones]

Hi, I've had a look on the Leicestershire Villages website, Newbold Verdon have a complete transcription for everyone living there at the time of the 1851 census.  They have her there, named as Helan Crowshaw, a widow aged 80, a pauper.  I'm guessing from the number of different interpretations of her name it must be very difficult to read but I think it must be our Theophilia.  Very possible if you think 'Crosher' could be pronounced as 'Crowsher'.  I don't know what my chances are of finding a death record for her, but I will check the parish records as soon as Hinckley Library reopens (closed for refurbishment at the moment), if they still have the records there after their reorganisation.  I assume that the census records are arranged geographically, do you know if this was the case?  If so, she appears to be quite close to a Halifax House.  There is still a Halifax Farm in Newbold Verdon, I'll try to find out if this is the same one or the same site.  If you want to take a look at the census records, I Googled 'Newbold Verdon census' and they came up on the Leicestershire Villages website under family history (they're on an excel spreadsheet).

[Sarah63]

I've had another look at the census image and can see why they went for Helan and yes if she couldn't spell her name it was reliant on the census numerator to put down their version of what they heard. When I first came across her I thought great an unusual name she'll be easy to find! How wrong I was! I don't think I've got her name spelt the same way twice!
Re: the layout of census, experience of other ones tell me they are generally laid out geographically so you can often identify locations of houses maps.nls.uk might help with this. It would be great to find a death record, goodness knows what name to look under! Keep hunting!
S x