Author Topic: Christening /Birth of George, Robert and James Broach  (Read 7279 times)

Offline AussieKate

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Christening /Birth of George, Robert and James Broach
« on: Tuesday 24 August 10 01:48 BST (UK) »
i was wondering if anybody can tell me the parents of Robert b 1811 or 1817, James b 1816 and George b1818 all in dumfries, Scotland.

Robert Broach b1811 or 1817 in Scotland d 1875 in Cheshire
1841 - ??? could have been overseas because some of thie children born in Spain
1851 - ??? could have been overseas because some of thie children born in Spain
1861 - RG9/2616/70/16 with wife mary living in cheshire
1871 - RG10/3710/140/29 with wife mary living in cheshire

George  Broach is my GG Grandfather i have his marriage Cert and it states his father as James Broach and his occupation was Blacksmith.  I have the following Census's for George
1841 - HO107/447/2/39/14 he is a draper with Jhon Broach (that is how it is spelt)
1851 - HO107/1713/234/6 he isi a drpaer sitll
1861 - RG9/130/7/11 living with wife Hannah
1871 - RG10/235/66/20 living with Hannah (under name Broash)
1881 - RG11//92/6 married but lodging with Lacey family
1891 -  RG12/131/97/38 married but with Martin family

James Broach b 1816 born in Scotland but lived in Bedfordshire d 1893
1841 - ???
1851 - HO107/1757/382/11 with wife Sophia
1861 - RG9/1012/23/14 with wife sophia
1871 - RG10/1569/43/4 with wife Sophia (broich)
1881 - RG11/1648/39/6 with wife sophia
1891 - RG12/1271/11/1 with wife sophia

thanks

Kate
Briers, Broach, Redman, Boxall, Burgess, Tomlinson, Pateman

Offline bleckie

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Re: Christening /Birth of George, Robert and James Broach
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 24 August 10 07:54 BST (UK) »
Hi Kate
On
www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk

using wildcard search bro*ch* you have the following results.


31/12/1801 BROATCH ROBERT ROBERT BROATCH/MARY JOHNSTONE FR20 M HALF MORTON /DUMFRIES 828/ 0010 0014
2 25/10/1809 BROATCH ROBERT WILLIAM BROATCH/ M KIRKPATRICK FLEMING (DUMFRIES) /DUMFRIES 837/ 0010 0213
3 31/08/1809 BROLOCHAN ROBERT DONALD BROLOCHAN/JANET SMITH CAMPBELTOWN /ARGYLL 507/ 0040 0339
4 31/05/1809 BROTCHIE ROBERT TRAILL G GEORGE BROTCHIE/JANET YORSTON 

Yours Aye
BruceL

Offline AussieKate

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Re: Christening /Birth of George, Robert and James Broach
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 24 August 10 11:13 BST (UK) »
i think that the father should be James Broach
Briers, Broach, Redman, Boxall, Burgess, Tomlinson, Pateman

Offline MonicaL

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Re: Christening /Birth of George, Robert and James Broach
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 24 August 10 17:44 BST (UK) »
Kate, gets confusing for everybody trying to help you when there are multiple posts with the same or similar requests, such as www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,477674.0.html. People trying to help you end up spending their time either doing searches that have already been done previoiusly, or their money (via SP units), which doesn't add to what has already been found for you to date.

How have you managed to verify some of the info you have? You have the potential father James, the blacksmith, in censuses up to at least 1871. Gadget suggested in an earlier post that the wife showing for James, Elizabeth, may have been a second wife given the slight difference in ages. Have you checked the death cert for this James on SP to see whether any info is noted on a potential first wife such as her name?

Have you verified through marriage certs the name(s)/occcupation of at least father for Robert b 1811 or 1817, James b 1816 and George b1818. George, I think you have as this is where you have the name James as father with the occupation of blacksmith. What about Robert and James? Robert if born c. 1811 might be a bit early to be the son of James, the potential blacksmith, that has been found with a birth year c. 1796. Do any of the census entries for Robert and James in England that you have actually show Dumfriesshire as their birth place?

Not sure how much more can be found on line given all searches that have been already done.

Monica
Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Offline MonicaL

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Re: Christening /Birth of George, Robert and James Broach
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 24 August 10 18:02 BST (UK) »
There are a number of trees showing on Ancestry for the line of James Broatch and Elizabeth Paterson. Possibility he died in Cumbria, England in 1881 (which is a pity as English death certs do not include any parents info/previous spouse details as Scottish certs can do).

James Broatch, 85
Whitehaven, Cumbria, Cumberland
2ns Qrt 1881
Vol. 10b Pg. 342

You can find his 1881 census entry in Arlecdon, Cumberland, just before he died on www.familysearch.org/Eng/Search/frameset_search.asp?PAGE=census/search_census.asp which can be searched for free for England.

Just one further point. Children to James and Elizabeth include a James b. 1842 and a Robert b. 1847 - this would not fit well if you are trying to connect the Robert and James you have born much earlier as likely brothers to your George and sons to this James.

Monica
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Offline AussieKate

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Re: Christening /Birth of George, Robert and James Broach
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 25 August 10 01:23 BST (UK) »
in the 1871 Census of James and Sophia Broach in Bedfordshire, there are 2 nephews one is George who is my GG Gandather and the other is Robert who is the son of Robert Broach.
the 1861 census of Robert Broach shows he was born in Dumfires, and the 1871 Census of James Broach says that he was born in Dumfriesshire.

I was curious about the fact that the James Broach who was born in 1796 had children with the same names of my relis and i doubt that they would not name 2 children the same unless one died.

i think that i will have to apply to get the marriage cert of James and Sophia Broach to see his fathers name and occupation.

Kate
Briers, Broach, Redman, Boxall, Burgess, Tomlinson, Pateman

Offline MonicaL

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Re: Christening /Birth of George, Robert and James Broach
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 25 August 10 11:59 BST (UK) »
Kate

Regarding potential brother Robert, married to Mary. The 1861 census shows eldest James born in Dumfries, Scotland c. 1840 and then next down, born in Liverpool, followed by the Spanish births.

I think this is the family in 1841 in the Liverpool area: HO107; Piece 564; Book: 15;Folio: 10; Page: 13. Robert, father, shows as an iron turner by trade. Two eldest born before son James, John and Martha, also show as born in Scotland.

This might be Martha's entry on IGI:

MARTHA THOMSON BROATCH Christening: 04 JUN 1837 Troqueer, Kirkcudbright, Scotland
Parents: ROBERT BROATCH and MARY THOMSON

Banns/marriage for parents show on IGI on 15 DEC 1833 Troqueer, Kirkcudbright and 16 DEC 1833 Dumfries, Dumfries.

Given the period of the marriage, not sure how much the OPR entry may show regarding Robert's father unfortunately.

Monica
Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline MonicaL

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Re: Christening /Birth of George, Robert and James Broach
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 25 August 10 12:30 BST (UK) »
Given the question marks over the likelyhood of the James Broatch, blacksmith with wife Elizabeth Paterson, I wonder if you have come across this entry:

1851:

Isabela Broutch 63, Blacksmiths Widow b. Dumfries, Dumfriesshire
Peter Broatch 30, son, agr. lab. b. Holywood, Dumfriesshire
Robert Miller 34, nephew, Pauper Cabinet Maker b. Abbey New
Charles Miller 10, nephew's son, b. England
Thomasina Currie 10m, niece's daughter b. Dumfries, Dumfriesshire

Address: Nethermill, Kirkmichael, Dumfriesshire

And in 1841:

Isabella Broatch 50, independent
Peter Broatch 20
Agnes Broatch 15

Address: Nethermill, Kirkmichael, Dumfriesshire

I see from one of your previous posts, www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,429233.0.html that in one census for George there is a possibility that George's birth place may have been Kirkmichael, as discussed with Gadget on that post - could fit with the above if you are able to confirm further.

Isabella is still living in Nethermill Village in 1871 with her son Peter and a granddaughter (think g/daughter is daughter of Thomasina Currie who showed earlier as a niece to Isabella) - you could perhaps check her death cert if she died in Scotland (possible entry showing for on SP), to confirm her husband's name and occupation. Or, alternatively, you also have Peter Broatch's death to check to see what it says regarding his parents.

Monica

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Offline AussieKate

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Re: Christening /Birth of George, Robert and James Broach
« Reply #8 on: Wednesday 25 August 10 15:18 BST (UK) »
that is quite an interesting find  :D  my only question is on George Broach's marriage Cert to Hannah Tomlinson in 1853 it does not say that the father was deceased, and on marriage certs that the father had died it has deceased on it dosen't it??

Kate
Briers, Broach, Redman, Boxall, Burgess, Tomlinson, Pateman