Author Topic: Kyrkes at Gwersyllt  (Read 32098 times)

Offline Adnepos_Iacobi

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Kyrkes at Gwersyllt
« on: Saturday 04 September 10 16:07 BST (UK) »
I am tracing cousins of mine, the Kyrkes/Kirkes/Kirks, who were in Chapel-en-Le-Frith, Derbyshire in the 16/17/18th century.

Richard KIRK was born at Chapel-en-le-Frith in about 1747, married Ellen VENABLES at Prestbury, Cheshire in 1771 and at some time moved to the Wrexham area. They had a family of twelve children, born between 1775 and 1792, five boys: Henry (1775, no issue), Thomas (1777, no issue), James (1778), George (1780) and Richard (1792). Incidentally, daughter Elizabeth married a Panton, Margaret married a John DICKENSON, Ellen married a Palin, Sarah married a Griffiths and Frances married Thomas PENSON the bridge builder.

Following the Kirk line, I then have a gap, picking up with Richard Venables KYRKE who must be a descendant of the above Richard and Ellen, probably a grandson; from census returns born at Gwersyllt about 1821. He married Fanny WARBRICK at Woodchurch, Wirral in 1849. They had at least four children. He died at Hawarden 1 April 1899 and was buried at (Old) Hope Cemetery.

The Kyrke family were prospering (landowners based at Martinside) at the time they moved from Derbyshire to the Wrexham area and by the early 19th century were in the coalmining business there. I have no evidence that they were in this business before they moved although I cannot completely exclude the possibility because coal was mined in the upper Goyt Valley about five miles from their Derbyshire home. They didn't appear to be short of capital because they rented out their properties in Chapel-en-le-Frith for a generation after they moved before selling up.

So please, any ideas why the family would move and how to test your idea?

Also, if anybody happens to know the fate of any of the twelve children of Richard and Fanny, in particular, which one was the father of Richard Venables KYRKE, you would save me the long  trip from the Cambridge area for the task of checking the several possible christening registers.
Powell (NTT) Hallam (DBY) Nadin (DBY) Hartley (Ancoats) Beech (Kirk Sandal) Potter (DBY)

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Offline maidmarion

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Re: Kyrkes at Gwersyllt
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 04 September 10 16:41 BST (UK) »
Hi
I've come across lots of Kyrkes and alternatives in the parish of Minera near Wrexham. :)

Not sure if you have these links.

The site at the link below is a useful tool and includes a key to the PR transcription booklets produed by Clwyd FHS.
http://www.namesfromclwyd.org.uk/

The Denbighshire Record Office has a personal names index which includes documents for Richard Venables and others. These aren't available online.
http://www.denbighshire.gov.uk/en-gb/DNAP-78GL8L

Also Welsh wills online
http://cat.llgc.org.uk/cgi-bin/gw/chameleon?skin=profeb&lng=en

maidmarion  :)


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Offline maidmarion

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Re: Kyrkes at Gwersyllt
« Reply #2 on: Saturday 04 September 10 16:50 BST (UK) »
"Eminent Men of Denbighshire" by H. Ellis Hughes

Richard Kirk, from Chapel-en-le-Frith, reopened the Minera leadmines in 1775, and opened pits in Brynmally and at Southsea.

Offline maidmarion

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Re: Kyrkes at Gwersyllt
« Reply #3 on: Saturday 04 September 10 16:57 BST (UK) »
Links to information on Minera. There used to be a link to the PRs online but unfortunately that site is no longer available.
http://www.minerahistory.com/


Offline Adnepos_Iacobi

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Re: Kyrkes at Gwersyllt
« Reply #4 on: Saturday 04 September 10 22:28 BST (UK) »
Many thanks for the links, maidmarion. You have pointed me to some very helpful material.

Lead and limestone mining at Minera is interesting because the these activities were going on a short distance southeast of Chapel-en-le-Frith, close to the home of Richard KIRK. So he may have moved to Minera to reopen lead mines.

I'll take a look at the book that you quote.

The christening of the Richard Venables KYRKE on http://www.namesfromclwyd.org.uk/ is in the 1836-1851 period so is probably that of the son of the Richard Venables KYRKE who interests me.
Powell (NTT) Hallam (DBY) Nadin (DBY) Hartley (Ancoats) Beech (Kirk Sandal) Potter (DBY)

Offline maidmarion

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Re: Kyrkes at Gwersyllt
« Reply #5 on: Sunday 05 September 10 09:16 BST (UK) »
Hi
I found these in Minera Chapelry Baptisms up to 1820.

Sep 15 1816, born 9.
Phoebe Hughes d/o William (farmer) and Catherine mn Keyrke, Nantyffrith

Jun 17 1818, Born 8 Mar
Franses Kyrke d/o James and Elizabeth mn Walker, Nantyffrith Lodge




Offline Adnepos_Iacobi

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Re: Kyrkes at Gwersyllt
« Reply #6 on: Sunday 05 September 10 11:50 BST (UK) »
Thanks again maidmarion.

I'm not surprised that the Kyrkes in Wales had children christened at a Wesleyan Chapel. Back in Derbyshire their ancestors had attended the Congegational Chapel (at Chinley) even though they were actively involved in parish activities; the Wesleyans hadn't 'got going' at the time the Kyrkes moved away from Derbyshire. Minera Chapel was established in 1804 so earlier Kyrke christenings in Wales would have taken place elsewhere. Richard was lead mining [at Minera] in 1775 (maidmarion's quote from a book by J Ellis Hughes) so the link to Minera Chapel 45 years later confirms the mining link.

I didn't know of Catherine KEYRKE who is the mother in the first christening at Minera Chapel mentioned by maidmarion. She isn't listed in Richard KIRK's (1747-1839) Bible, which seems to list all his children but since she had given birth in 1816, she is more likely to be a grand-daughter. With a name like Keyrke, living in Nantyffrith, the two must be related!

From the above mentioned family bible, James KYRKE son of Richard was born 8 Oct 1778. The second christening at Minera mentioned by maidmarion could feature this James as a father aged 50 years but could easily be a grandson. The death of a James KYRKE was registered at Wrexham Q4 1857; the only information in the Administration, granted 21 November 1857 (hey, ordering documents from The National Library of Wales is quick and easy!), is that James was the brother of Richard Venables KYRKE (1821-1899). So if I find the father of James KYRKE (died 1857), I find the father of Richard Venables KYRKE, which would then link the 18th century with the 19th century Kyrkes in Wales.

According to website information that maidmarion pointed me to, a James KYRKE bought Nantyffrith Hall from a tea trader named Peek in 1865. In the absence of any indication in the Administration that James (d 1857) had a wife and children, it's likely that this James would be a nephew; not a son of James (d 1857) and no evidence of him being a son of Richard Venebales KYRKE.

But I'm still looking for some clue for why a family that was prospering in Derbyshire moved to Wales. Any ideas?
Powell (NTT) Hallam (DBY) Nadin (DBY) Hartley (Ancoats) Beech (Kirk Sandal) Potter (DBY)

Offline maidmarion

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Re: Kyrkes at Gwersyllt
« Reply #7 on: Sunday 05 September 10 13:05 BST (UK) »
Minera Chapelry wasn't a non conformist chapel, it was church of Wales so anglican.
http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/DEN/Minera/index.html


Offline wilcoxon

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Re: Kyrkes at Gwersyllt
« Reply #8 on: Monday 06 September 10 18:58 BST (UK) »
“Brymbo and it`s Neighbourhood “ by Graham Rogers.
In 1769 a lease of The  Lodge Estate  granted to John Phillips and William Price and by arrangement John Wilkinson dug for iron and Richard Kirk for coal.
 Richard Kirks mines at Brynmally opened in 1770

Ffrwd Canal.
Richard Kirk was closely connected with this branch of Ellesmere canal system.
Born at Martin-side, Chapel en Frith c 1747. He came to this area c 1775 .
In 1820 together with John Burton he leased the Minera `City` Lands for 21 years and worked the lead ore. He died in 1839.
Census information is Crown Copyright (see: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk)