Author Topic: Help Please - Arthur Edwin Westhorp - around 1855  (Read 11451 times)

Offline mrsearch

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Re: Help Please - Arthur Edwin Westhorp - around 1855
« Reply #27 on: Saturday 05 February 11 04:30 GMT (UK) »
I'm sorry to be a pain, but I'm interested in a little bit more help.  We have found Alice W in the 1911 census (she's home alone) but the census form identifies that she had four children, three of whom are still living.  No names etc included.  Is there any form of record that anyone knows about that lists the whole family of a person?  Other than census records... we haven't managed to find a single census record that would give her four children.  So far we know about Alice W (1880 -1884), Arthur Dilks (1884) and Robert Stanley (1888).  We don't get any other children at any of her residences in any census... So, I'm hoping there's some other type of record. 
Westhorp - Essex

Offline Valda

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Re: Help Please - Arthur Edwin Westhorp - around 1855
« Reply #28 on: Saturday 05 February 11 11:27 GMT (UK) »
Hi


There are censuses, civil registration and parish registers.


The 1911 census with the other family information about another brother William (nothing showing on censuses) leaves you with the possibility perhaps that a son may have been 'given up'?


Wiliam Hast Westhorp's birth wasn't in Poplar like the other three children, but Louisa Catherine was getting on by 1886 - she would have been about 45.


Births Jun 1886   Westhorp  William Hast    W. Ham  4a 80

Births Dec 1840 Westhorp  Louisa Catherine    Stepney  2 421


29th October 1878 The Standard
Marriages
Westhorp- Westhorp
Oct 26th at Buckhurst-hill Congregational Church by the Rev W H Charlesworth assisted by the Rev H J Bevis of Ramsgate, William Hast Westhorp to Louisa Catherine, eldest daughter of T. Westhorp, Esq. of Loughton Essex.


1871 census RG10 16?8 folio 49
Holmehurst Manor Road Loughton Essex
Theopolis Westhorp 57 Head Married Ship owner & ship chandler patent oakum manufactory 164 men and 20 boys Harwich Essex
Rebecca Westhorp 56 Wife Married Poplar Middlesex
Louisa Westhorp 30 Daughter Poplar Middlesex
Alice Westhorp 16 Daughter Poplar Middlesex
Eliza Westhorp 77 Sister Unmarried Harwich Essex
plus 2 visitors and 3 servants


First World War army officers records are not online. This may be William's records at The National Archives

WO 339/66267 WESTHORP W [1914-1922]

William Hast Westhorp senior left a will as did his wife. Both wills could be sent for and of course there is the birth certificate which would settle it one way or the other.



Regards

Valda
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Offline mrsearch

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Re: Help Please - Arthur Edwin Westhorp - around 1855
« Reply #29 on: Saturday 05 February 11 12:00 GMT (UK) »
Thanks again Valda. You must have the most amazing super search engine running full time to get all this stuff.  We have in fact ordered William Hast's (1886) birth certificate, but we're with you on this - that he is in fact a cousin of Arthur D and Robert S and not the missing child.  Will just have to wait and see...  So we are left with the open mystery of another child!  Our only hint is a photo of 'uncle gordon' who (apart from his looks) could be anyone!  My brother is fascinated by how you found the Standard reference.  Is there an Archive on newspapers in England that is accessible on line?   I hope you are not spending too many hours on our behalf, although we greatly appreciate the assistance you are giving.
Westhorp - Essex

Offline pjrcw

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Re: Help Please - Arthur Edwin Westhorp - around 1855
« Reply #30 on: Sunday 06 February 11 10:30 GMT (UK) »
Hello All,

Regarding William hast Westhorp  1886-1917, although everyone keeps suggesting that he may have been a cousin he was definitely my Grandfathers Brother. I have proof of this as his war medal was sent to my  Grandfather ( Arthur Dilks) see document below:

It may be that William Hast was taken care of by other relatives from an early age, but they certainly keep in touch.

Maybe the fourth child was Alice Winifred Westhorp  1880-1884 who died at an early age as stated before.


Offline mrsearch

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Re: Help Please - Arthur Edwin Westhorp - around 1855
« Reply #31 on: Sunday 06 February 11 10:51 GMT (UK) »
I've ordered William Hast 1886's birth certificate from the GRO and expect that it will arrive here in about a fortnight.  I'll post it up as soon as I get it.  If he is Alice's fourth child that will solve one mystery, but I think the census info is pretty strong.  So if he's not...  I'm trying to restrain my impatience!
Westhorp - Essex

Offline Valda

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Re: Help Please - Arthur Edwin Westhorp - around 1855
« Reply #32 on: Sunday 06 February 11 14:19 GMT (UK) »
Hi

William Hast Westhorp and his wife Louisa may have taken in one of the three surviving children to relieve the burden on Alice after her husband died and because they themselves were childless. The logical child would be the one named William Hast if that was the case. If the birth certificate proves he was Alice and Arthur's child it would be worth sending for copies of their two wills (see the guide on the Essex board to wills). William's schooling shows he was receiving the benefit of William and Louisa's more comfortable circumstances (William Hast left the equivalent of about £84,000 in today's money in his will in 1891). The other family members may also have benefitted.


You may be able to check whether Seaford College have William Hast in their records

http://www.seaford.org/alumni.php



Regards

Valda
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Offline mrsearch

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Re: Help Please - Arthur Edwin Westhorp - around 1855
« Reply #33 on: Sunday 06 February 11 21:16 GMT (UK) »
Thanks Valda - yes I've been in contact with the people currently running the Old Seafordians - still waiting for them to get back to me.  They were celebrating the 90th birthday of the author of their history book (the society is currently run by the author's daughter) so I'm expecting something of a delay!  The original feedback indicates that detailed lists of boarders etc may not be available so I've decided not to hold my breath.

It all hangs on the birth certificate - as usual!  Waiting, waiting, waiting... (not my strong point, but I think this process is going to help me improve it!   :))
Westhorp - Essex

Offline mrsearch

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Re: Help Please - Arthur Edwin Westhorp - around 1855
« Reply #34 on: Thursday 24 February 11 02:16 GMT (UK) »
Well I am very happy to say that the birth certificate for William Hast Westhorp (the 4th) has arrived and we finally know that everyone is right! 

William Hast Westhorp (4) was born on 11 March 1886 in West Ham and is the missing child of Alice Lucy Dilks and Arthur Edwin Westhorp which means he is Arthur Dilks and Robert Stanley's brother.  He was, therefore, apparently given up to William Hast (3) and his wife Louisa given the census records for him with them.  As noted in Valda's last post WHW (3) was quite wealthy, which may have been something to do with Louisa who was the eldest child of Theophilus Westhorp who had patents on oakum picking machines and ran/owned a factory (the Falcon Works Oakum Factory) in partnership with a Mr Wright.  Theo and family lived in a very large residence (still in existence) with a few domestic servants so Louisa and WHW (3) (who were cousins before they got married and who married quite late) may well have benefited.  Theo is known to have 'passed on' the factory to a William Hast Westhorp - in the docs I've seen this is described as his brother (who would have been too old) so I now suspect it may have been to his nephew/son-in-law.

Very excited now!!


Westhorp - Essex

Offline geniecolgan

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Re: Help Please - Arthur Edwin Westhorp - around 1855
« Reply #35 on: Thursday 24 February 11 04:43 GMT (UK) »
Hi mrsearch,

I'm very pleased the brothers are reunited.

Good news indeed  ;D
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