Author Topic: James Howe, and son? Joseph Howe  (Read 38188 times)

Offline tewilso

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Re: James Howe, and son? Joseph Howe
« Reply #9 on: Tuesday 01 March 11 13:37 GMT (UK) »
Dear Nell,

Thank you for your expert advice. Ruperta Howe did not leave a will according to another online expert who informed me that the detailed pedigree of the Howe descendants of Prince Rupert is given by Frederick Arthur Crisp, The Visitation of England and Wales: Notes, , volume 13 (1919). Apparently, Crisp's own copy is be found in the Family History Library at 942 D23hn or on Microfilm 824,461.

On another note, I did uncover some documents pertaining to the Howe's in that time period on file at the University of Nottingham (being in the States, I won't be able to personally consult them this year). The document is entitled: Papers of the Smith-Bromley Family of East Stoke, Nottinghamshire 1305-1876. Reference GB 19 Sm. Of particular interest to me is the addendum contained therein entitled: Account of the relations and estates of Mary Howe, Sm 306 c1744.

Mary Howe was the 1st cousin of James Howe, whose common grandmother was Ruperta Howe. Sm 306 may therefore hold some fascinating clues to the death of James Howe, and perhaps may mention his son, Joseph, if James had issue.

There are a number of other Sm's available in the Papers of Smith-Bromley that refer to payments to Ruperta Howe (in her last year of life 1740-1741), as well as a number entitled: "Howe vs. Bromley".

Would you happen to know how I might obtain the above document/s if my email to the U-Nott library is ignored?

Best wishes,

Thomas Wilson

Offline tewilso

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Re: James Howe, and son? Joseph Howe
« Reply #10 on: Tuesday 01 March 11 14:03 GMT (UK) »
Correction - the common grandfather of Mary Howe and James Howe was John Grubham Howe of Langar.

Offline Little Nell

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Re: James Howe, and son? Joseph Howe
« Reply #11 on: Tuesday 01 March 11 22:00 GMT (UK) »
According to the information about this particular set of papers on the A2A site,

Quote
Photocopies and photographic copies can be supplied for educational use and private study purposes only depending on the condition of the documents.

We'll have to hope that they are in good condition.  Details of the service provided, the submission form (necessary to complete!) and costs can be found via this page:

http://www.nottingham.ac.uk/manuscriptsandspecialcollections/reprographics/introduction.aspx

Frustrating - I can find the later generations of the Howes and references to Rupert , but the middle part is distinctly vague.  :(

Nell
All census information: Crown Copyright www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline tewilso

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Re: James Howe, and son? Joseph Howe
« Reply #12 on: Tuesday 01 March 11 23:43 GMT (UK) »
Thanks for the link! I've contacted them and will be excited to learn their response.


Offline tewilso

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Re: James Howe, and son? Joseph Howe
« Reply #13 on: Sunday 06 March 11 14:54 GMT (UK) »
I've deduced that the Mary Howe in question, was the daughter of William Howe, brother of James Howe. Mary Howe would have been nearly the same age as her 1st cousin, my sought-after Joseph Howe. So this implies the "Relations and Estate of Mary Howe" referred to earlier, would have a higher probability of listing her only living 1st cousin. Mary Howe married on 18th August 1747 Sir George Smith Bt, later Bromley.

In addition, there is another compendium that refers to settling the estate of Ruperta Howe (Mary and Joseph Howe's grandmother) shortly after her death in 1741: "Particulars of the Forest of Alice Holt, Woolmer co. S'ton, and houses and lodges thereto belonging held from the Crown under a Grant to E.S. Howe  Sm 1113  1742".

If Joseph Howe was indeed who we believe he is, he undoubtedly will be listed in Sm 1113. I am awaiting word from the U-Nottingham Library.

Thomas

Offline tewilso

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Re: James Howe, and son? Joseph Howe
« Reply #14 on: Tuesday 08 March 11 12:17 GMT (UK) »
Some good news ... the above-mentioned documents at U-Nottingham from the Papers of the Smith-Bromley Family, were available for photocopying and are being sent to me.

Offline tewilso

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Re: James Howe, and son? Joseph Howe
« Reply #15 on: Saturday 09 April 11 22:25 BST (UK) »
"The Papers of the Smith-Bromley Family" GB 19 SM (U-Nottingham) contained an addendum "Miss Howe's Case" SM1112. In the latter, it is stated that both James and Emanuel Howe died without issue.  I kept up the search however; I was surprised to have found in the "Will of John How, Gentleman of Woodford (and of St. Bartholomew by the Exchange) (1747)" from the National Archives (Canterbury). Remarkably, in the first paragraph, he disinherits his eldest son, Joseph How, for excessive spending. His other sons John and Robert, witnessed the will, but Joseph did not. I have found the baptismal records of the the three sons - St. Bartholomew by the Exchange. Joseph was born 14 May, 1704. According to family lore in the States, our Joseph Howe immigrated to Boston imn 1747 - the same year that Joseph Howe was disinherited!

I believe have found the brother's will, John How, Gentleman of Romford 1775. In it, the brother Robert witnesses the will of his brother John, but not Joseph. The John How of Woodford, I believe is the son of John How, Gentleman of Somerset-Earnley, the grand-nephew of Sir George Howe, 2nd Baronet. I surmise that Robert How could also be the grandfather of Edward James Gambier Howe (Howes of Chart Place). I would very much like to obtain the pedigree of these Howes, to verify my hypotheses. I have requested the
"Papers of the Gambier Howe Family" from Kent County Archives, in hopes of finding mention of Joseph. Thank you.

Offline med Nell

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Re: James Howe, and son? Joseph Howe
« Reply #16 on: Sunday 19 June 11 03:51 BST (UK) »
Are there any more information for Joseph How (Howe). 
I am attempting to verify a connection between my 6th-grandfather removed, Joseph Howe (a friend of George Washington) who immigrated to Virginia. Joseph Howe purportedly was 2nd cousin to General George Augustus Howe, 3nd Viscount, General William Howe, 5rd Viscount Howe and Admiral Richard Howe, 4th Viscount. On this side of the pond, family history has it that he was the son of one James Howe, who was born in 1704 and buried at Binsted on April 6, 1728, near his mother Ruperta Howe, buried at Binsted in July 27th, 1741.

Any information would be most appreciated!

Thomas

Offline tewilso

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Re: James Howe, and son? Joseph Howe
« Reply #17 on: Sunday 19 June 11 12:18 BST (UK) »
Thank you. Well, I've recently obtained the services of a Ms. Potter, a UK genealogist specializing in Somerset and Wiltshire families to pursue two possibilities.

In addition to the Joseph Howe, son of John Howe of Woodford, Essex, who was disinherited in 1747, I have also read on the British history website (http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=115493) concerning the owners of several manors in Netheravon in Wiltshire, included St. Amand’s Manor, owned by the 1st-3rd Baronet Howe of Compton (Sir John, Richard, and Richard Howe) from whom ownership passed to Richard's cousin, John Howe, 1st Lord Chedworth. There is mentioned another manor, called Netheravon at Haxton, that was owned by a Joseph Howe and his wife Elizabeth; they sold this manor to the Duke of Beaufort in 1739. If this Joseph Howe was related to the Baronet Howe of Compton, and either he or a possible son immigrated to the colonies, that would close the loop of the claimed connection. The timeline and claimed ancestry fit. Also, my Joseph Howe's first two children were named Joseph and Elizabeth (the same as his parents if I am correct about the lineage). I cannot find a will for a Joseph Howe at the Prerogative Court of Canterbury. Also, I've not been able to find a will for Robert Howe of Pyrgo Park (sibling of the disinherited Joseph Howe) nor have I received a reply to a letter sent to a descendent of Henry Gambier Howe of the White House in Suffolk (Robert's descendent), who was last listed at that address in 1984. My brother and I will visit the gravesite of Joseph Howe in Sunnyside, VA this summer - our 6th grandfather. Best, Tom