Author Topic: witton cemetery aston birmingham  (Read 28444 times)

Offline Steven1966

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Re: witton cemetery aston birmingham
« Reply #9 on: Friday 15 June 07 18:19 BST (UK) »
Be prepared for the fact that she may have had a paupers grave, (although I am not saying she did).

A lot of the family that I have tried to trace who were buried  at Witton in 1918/19/20/21, etc, were buried in paupers graves and as such at the time had no grave markers.

In the 1940's (according to the ladies at the cemetery office) fresh earth to a depth of 9ft was spread over many area's containing these paupers graves/plots. Therefore creating new burial land, without having to remove any bodies.

These new plots were sold off to people who could afford to pay for them. These "new plots" were positioned almost exactly over the old paupers graves and in most cases carried the same plot number.

I have been in the unusual position of standing at a spot that was once a paupers grave containing a relative and the plot is now marked by a  headstone, for a completely unrelated family. So I would be standing at a headstone for say a "Smith" in this new earth laid in the 1940's, while my relative a "Coulson" was in a grave, in the old earth underneath, and therefore under "Smith".
Surnames that I am intersted in are:- Siddons, Coulson, Clives, White, Cullin, Peers, Swingler, Lambeth, Quibell, Greenway, Beaman, Durrie, and Gibbs, all of Aston/Duddeston/Hockley in Birmingham,Warwickshire and Inskeep of Shrewsbury Shropshire and Birimingham

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Offline darthdc

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Re: witton cemetery aston birmingham
« Reply #10 on: Wednesday 20 June 07 14:06 BST (UK) »
She was buried in a "common" grave which was unmarked. Strange, but if there is another grave on top, it too is unmarked.


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Offline Steven1966

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Re: witton cemetery aston birmingham
« Reply #11 on: Wednesday 20 June 07 18:43 BST (UK) »
Which section was she buried in?

Common graves themselves quite often contained as many as 6/7 unrelated people.

Stephen
Surnames that I am intersted in are:- Siddons, Coulson, Clives, White, Cullin, Peers, Swingler, Lambeth, Quibell, Greenway, Beaman, Durrie, and Gibbs, all of Aston/Duddeston/Hockley in Birmingham,Warwickshire and Inskeep of Shrewsbury Shropshire and Birimingham

Offline darthdc

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Re: witton cemetery aston birmingham
« Reply #12 on: Wednesday 20 June 07 18:48 BST (UK) »
She was buried in section 48, #41513. I found graves 41512 and 41514 and there was an open space between them which I presume is 41513. It seems I may only ever discover when she died as I cannot find anything else on her.

Offline Steven1966

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Re: witton cemetery aston birmingham
« Reply #13 on: Wednesday 20 June 07 19:45 BST (UK) »
Both of my Grandparents are buried in the "new ground" laid down on top of the common graves of section 48 (they were buried in 1967 & 2002). My grandmother always wondered where her own parents were buried, who died in 1918 and 1919, all she new was that it was Witton.

Her father turned out to be in section 48 in a common grave 41450, in the "old ground". There is a plot 41450 today above him, but to an unrelated family. When I looked up from the spot where I was standing, I was a matter of 50ft from my Grandmothers grave, buried so close to her father but he of course is at a much greater depth than her. Her mother turned out to be almost as close, just across from her in section 47(section 47 and 48 merge into each other at roughly the point her mother is buried).

The open space would indeed be 41513, where the ladies at the cemetery office able to tell you the last known address at the time of her death of your Great Grandmother. That would be a start towards finding out more about her.

Stephen
Surnames that I am intersted in are:- Siddons, Coulson, Clives, White, Cullin, Peers, Swingler, Lambeth, Quibell, Greenway, Beaman, Durrie, and Gibbs, all of Aston/Duddeston/Hockley in Birmingham,Warwickshire and Inskeep of Shrewsbury Shropshire and Birimingham

Offline darthdc

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Re: witton cemetery aston birmingham
« Reply #14 on: Thursday 21 June 07 10:04 BST (UK) »
I actually knew where she died anyhow - I had recently tracked her death certificate which told me she died on 18/11/1919 at 10 Oxygen Street. Her second daughter (my gran) was the informant, living at same address, despite getting married 3 months earlier. I found the certificate at the second attempt as I found another Harriet Hunt that died 4 years earlier, 4 years younger. I tried that one but it drew a blank because it didn't tie up with Charles Hunt. That proved to be decisive detail in getting it. I can't understand why they don't show marital status on mens death certificates. I've got one for a Charles Hunt who died in 1942. The informant is a son WH Hunt. I've heard that they had a son known as Harry. Whether this is him, I don't know. The occupation fits however. I've found a second one on the index who died in 1924. I just wish there was a way of asking the registrar if they can search up the informants name too.
The main problem I have is that I cannot find out when Harriet was born. She was born in Worcester between Nov 1860 and March 1861. Her maiden name was Taylor (her daughter's birth certificates all say that). I cannot even find her marriage either.

Offline Steven1966

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Re: witton cemetery aston birmingham
« Reply #15 on: Thursday 21 June 07 11:56 BST (UK) »
I can't find a death certificate for my G G Grandfather a Joseph White, information that I have, suggests he died between 1881 and 1891. This I have based on the fact that my G G Grandmother was living alone with her son George (my G Grandfather) and declaring herself a widow in 1891, she remarried in 1900.

The only match that showed any promise was a Joseph White that died in 1896. The age was right, but the occupation was wrong. The informant was his daughter an E Thompson (my G G Grandparents had two children an Emily and a George). It's possible that the informant, E Thompson is an Emily White who married a "Thompson", but I can't find a marriage to support this. Then of course 1896 is 5 years after my G G Grandmother first declared herself (to the best of my Knowledge) a widow!!. Lastly when George married in 1902, one of the witness's was an Emily White!!!!

Their son George (my G Grandfather) was born some where between mid 1876 and march 1877. His marriage certificate in 1902 and the CWGC database stating he died in March 1915 aged 38, support this, but even after three years of searching I cannot find a birth certificate for him.

Last year I joined a family history/research class, not because I thought they could teach me anything (it was a beginners class). But so I could pick the brains of the tutor who had been doing family research for 35 years. A Long time before the creation of the internet and computers became affordable. I asked him questions very similar to yours, based on the information above.

He said as far as births were concerned, conservative estimates show that as late as the 1870's /early 1880's as many as 10/15% of births were still not been registered. As for deaths there is no legal requirement (or there wasn't) for a man's marrital status to be declared on a death certificate, which may not be known anyway, especially if the informant wasn't family. Informants could give (and did give) any name they wished, they didn't have to prove who they were. There was no reqirement for a full name or proof of indentity to be given. Even if it were, how it was recorded (initial or full name) was down to the person who filled out the original death certificate, the doctor and /or the registra. The registra can only give you or I the information that is on the certificate. If it was given wrongly or recorded wrongly, then in all probability we may never be able to tell. I will keep searching for now, but the tutor did say there will come a point where you will have to accept that there is no more information to be found, something that has happened to him more than once, while doing his own family tree.

Did Harriet have more than one name? I have a female relative who' names were Emily  Mary  Margaret. Depending on what I assume was her  mood at the time, I have found her recorded as either Emily, Mary  or  Margaret. It has made un picking  her history, quite interesting to say the least!!!
Surnames that I am intersted in are:- Siddons, Coulson, Clives, White, Cullin, Peers, Swingler, Lambeth, Quibell, Greenway, Beaman, Durrie, and Gibbs, all of Aston/Duddeston/Hockley in Birmingham,Warwickshire and Inskeep of Shrewsbury Shropshire and Birimingham

Offline darthdc

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Re: witton cemetery aston birmingham
« Reply #16 on: Thursday 21 June 07 13:50 BST (UK) »
I only have the birth records for her 3 daughters, plus the death of the third (at the age of 1). Harriett was informant on all. She signed the first certificate in full but on the others as H Hunt. It was only when I got the birth certificate for her eldest daughter that I discovered her name had 2 t's at the end. The registrar always put her name as Harriet rather than Harriett. At least her death certificate put this error right.
What doesn't help either is that I cannot find her married to Charles Hunt before the 1901 census, nor together at least. Charles Hunt was born in Birmingham, moved to Worcester at some time, got married, moved back to Birmingham and stayed there till his death. The thing I would like is for Charles Hunt's death certificate to say "widower of Harriett Hunt" or be signed by a Alice Field (eldest daughter) or Ellen Cook (my gran). Their third daughter died aged just 13 months in 1901.

But for names, I know what you mean. My late aunt Rose was born Ellen Rose but took her middle name to avoid confusion with her mom (my gran Ellen Cook). Alice Field's (my Gt Aunt) husband Horace was known as Joey (his middle name was Joseph). It's one thing that in a way bothers me. I was born after my gran died, and she would have been able to answer a lot of the questions. Her children are not all that cooperative - my dad inherited the house when his siblings thought it would be divided between them. They managed to help themselves to a few family heirlooms, including photos of my great grandparents. If they still exist, I would like to see them, but whoever has them is hiding them.

Offline timetraveller

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Re: witton cemetery aston birmingham
« Reply #17 on: Saturday 29 September 07 13:14 BST (UK) »
I have several ancesters buried in Witton cemetery. 

I recently received pictures of the graves of my grt grt grandparents in there.  But it presents me more mystery than before!  I have their death certificates but it doesn't correspond with the dates on the gravestones.  One date is several years out.  There are no other deaths in this time frame of the names (not a common name) so I have a few possibilities.

Isn't family history wonderful for mystery!