Author Topic: Thomas Bowles-b c1826 Norwich  (Read 10389 times)

Offline Rochdalian

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Thomas Bowles-b c1826 Norwich
« on: Saturday 16 April 11 03:09 BST (UK) »
Hi

I am trying to place Thomas into a family :)  I first come across him in in the 1841 census living with Sarah Bowles (possibly Ethelinda Sarah Rainford Cookson), married age 50, and Judith (later known as Sarah) Bowles aged 10 her daughter and a Jaen male aged 6.  Due to the limitations of the 1841 census I don't know the relationship between Sarah and Thomas - she could be his mother or auntie?.  I know that Judith/Sarah is Sarah's daughter as Sarah is living with her and her husband Christopher Nelson in 1851.  I found a Thomas, a carpenter, on the 1851 census as a 'visitor' in the household of the Grand family in Norwich.  However I also found a Thomas, of the right age and birthplace, as a transported convict to VDL in 1842/3.  On his indent he states his father is Edmund of Yarmouth and his mother Sarah - I can't make out the rest.  After his certificate of freedom in 1850 Thomas took ship from Launceston to Calcutta.  In 1853 a Thomas Rainford Day Bowles turns up in Geelong getting married, I have not been able to find an arrival into Australia.  Also Judith/Sarah and Christopher migrated to Victoria, still looking for their arrival also. 

I am trying to find if Thomas and Judith/Sarah were siblings and if the transported Thomas made it back to Australia and added a few names.  What makes me think there is a connection is that the names 'Rainford' & 'Day' crop up in mentions of both families.

Sorry to make it so long and I'm hoping some one can help please

Cheers

Bob       
Pearson - Yorkshire
Flinders - Notts/Lincs/Lyon
Dearden - Rochdale
Grindrod - Rochdale
Reynolds - Staffs/Cornwall
Tortoishell - Staffs
Cooper, Freeman, Parnell, Love, Hargreaves - Rutland
Maslen - Wiltshire/Victoria, Australia
Kenny - Germany
Edwards - Greater London/Victoria, Australia
Bartlett, Gee, Padbury - Northants
Rampoley, Allom - Suffolk
Detlefsen, Herse, Iversen, Boisen/Boysen - Denmark
Xylander - Germany
Dundon - Co Limerick
Mullins - Devon

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Offline Yorkslass

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Re: Thomas Bowles-b c1826 Norwich
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 16 April 11 12:13 BST (UK) »
Hello Bob,

I've searched for Thomas under every surname possible - Bowles, Rainford, Cookson, Day, and come up with nothing I'm afraid.  I wondered, as I'm sure you have, whether Thomas was born before his mother married.

You've obviously seen the marriage of Sarah Rainford/Cookson to Edmund Bowles, at Lakenham, just outside Norwich.  The witnesses don't give any clues either.

I wonder if you have seen this - the baptism of Edmund Bowles by Edmund and Sarah (Rainford) - http://www.rootschat.com/links/0csf/

And this - baptism of Judith - http://www.rootschat.com/links/0csg/

I guess all it proves is that Judith's father was an Edmund Bowles, and they moved around a lot!

Yorkslass
Norris, London 1800's
Bird, Gt Yarmouth 1800's
Smowton, Yarmouth/Norwich 1770
Dublack, Yarmouth
Binks, Essex
Wilcock, Lancashire
Kettlewell, Yorkshire

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Offline Rochdalian

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Re: Thomas Bowles-b c1826 Norwich
« Reply #2 on: Saturday 16 April 11 23:35 BST (UK) »
Thanks Yorkslass for your searching and hints :)  The two, possibly three, Thomas' that I have identified as possibles were all born in the vacinity of 1825/6 so yes he certainly was born before the marriage as was a John Bowles that I have just come across as being born c1824 of Edmund & Sarah.  I'm not really sure about him but various trees and a DNA project have him as a son.  That project has Judith but not Thomas or Edmund, so the Thomas living with Sarah in 1841 may not be her son but her nephew!! ???  Aaaahhhhhh

Hadn't seen the two baptisms you sent as I'm still coming to grips with the new family search site :-[  I must work on that, is there an easier way to search than just opening page after page? ;)

Cheers

Bob
Pearson - Yorkshire
Flinders - Notts/Lincs/Lyon
Dearden - Rochdale
Grindrod - Rochdale
Reynolds - Staffs/Cornwall
Tortoishell - Staffs
Cooper, Freeman, Parnell, Love, Hargreaves - Rutland
Maslen - Wiltshire/Victoria, Australia
Kenny - Germany
Edwards - Greater London/Victoria, Australia
Bartlett, Gee, Padbury - Northants
Rampoley, Allom - Suffolk
Detlefsen, Herse, Iversen, Boisen/Boysen - Denmark
Xylander - Germany
Dundon - Co Limerick
Mullins - Devon

Offline Yorkslass

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Re: Thomas Bowles-b c1826 Norwich
« Reply #3 on: Sunday 17 April 11 00:23 BST (UK) »
Yes, it's very complicated isn't it!  I did see those DNA projects - fascinating!

I thought perhaps with Thomas indicating his father was Edmund was a good sign you'd got the right Thomas - who was the transported convict.  He may have lived with Edmund, Sarah, Judith and Jaen, and never been told he if had a different father.

I had a quick look at the online newspaper site, and found an entry in the Bury & Norwich Post, of 4 January 1843 - "Yarmouth Sessions" - "Thomas Bowles, aged 16, found guilty of breaking into the shop of Wm Beevor and stealing 2s 10d in money, was sentenced to be transported for seven years, with a view to his being recommended to the Reformatory"

Unfortunately, it doesn't say which Reformatory.  Shame, cause those records would help a lot, I expect.

As to the registers, I'm afraid there is no other way, as they haven't been indexed - as a good friend of mine says, "It's just guess and go."  What I do, is if I find a "right" baptism, I look forwards and backwards to see if there are any more in that parish.

Here's another one for you - this one is a bit "odd" as it says the father is a traveller - but it certainly looks like another child for Sarah and Edmund - this time Sarah is shown as "Sarah Athelinda", baptised 25 May 1834 at St Mary Coslany, Norwich - http://www.rootschat.com/links/0csr/

I'll have another look tomorrow - Bowles is a name that could be mis-transcribed isn't it?

Best wishes,
Yorkslass


Norris, London 1800's
Bird, Gt Yarmouth 1800's
Smowton, Yarmouth/Norwich 1770
Dublack, Yarmouth
Binks, Essex
Wilcock, Lancashire
Kettlewell, Yorkshire

Offline Rochdalian

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Re: Thomas Bowles-b c1826 Norwich
« Reply #4 on: Sunday 17 April 11 12:50 BST (UK) »
Ah yes it is indeed complicated.  Our ancestors played fast and loose with their names didn't they!?

Yes that's Thomas the transported you found in the paper.  Is the online newspapre site one that anyone can look at for nothing? ;)

Looks like I'd better start 'guessing & going' through the records!  Thanks for the latest one as well.  Do you think the 'traveller' meant the same in 1834 as it does now ie. gypsy? 

Thanks for continuing to look.

Cheers

Bob   
Pearson - Yorkshire
Flinders - Notts/Lincs/Lyon
Dearden - Rochdale
Grindrod - Rochdale
Reynolds - Staffs/Cornwall
Tortoishell - Staffs
Cooper, Freeman, Parnell, Love, Hargreaves - Rutland
Maslen - Wiltshire/Victoria, Australia
Kenny - Germany
Edwards - Greater London/Victoria, Australia
Bartlett, Gee, Padbury - Northants
Rampoley, Allom - Suffolk
Detlefsen, Herse, Iversen, Boisen/Boysen - Denmark
Xylander - Germany
Dundon - Co Limerick
Mullins - Devon

Offline Yorkslass

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Re: Thomas Bowles-b c1826 Norwich
« Reply #5 on: Monday 18 April 11 11:52 BST (UK) »
Hello again,

The newspapers I searched are free to view, but online through my local library, here in the UK.

I would have thought traveller meant the same then as it does now.

I did notice on the 1851 census, that Sarah (living with her daughter and son in law) is down as married, whereas in 1861, where she's living with her son John and his family, she says Widow.  So Edmund must have died between then. I've looked for a death, but can't find one. 

I've looked at your other post - and it looks as though Thomas Bowles was indeed Edmund and Sarah's son, doesn't it? 

But of course, more questions to find the answers to!

Yorkslass

Norris, London 1800's
Bird, Gt Yarmouth 1800's
Smowton, Yarmouth/Norwich 1770
Dublack, Yarmouth
Binks, Essex
Wilcock, Lancashire
Kettlewell, Yorkshire

Offline Rochdalian

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Re: Thomas Bowles-b c1826 Norwich
« Reply #6 on: Monday 18 April 11 13:00 BST (UK) »
Hi Yorkslass

Yes Edmund is a worry,  however I have found an Edmund Bowles being transported to VDL in 1844.  He came from Norwich and he states that he has a wife Sarah and two kids.  Only thing that is not quite right is the age he gave at conviction 33 which makes him born about 1811.  Of course we do know that they fibbed a bit about their ages on occasion.  I'll look into him a bit more.

Bob
Pearson - Yorkshire
Flinders - Notts/Lincs/Lyon
Dearden - Rochdale
Grindrod - Rochdale
Reynolds - Staffs/Cornwall
Tortoishell - Staffs
Cooper, Freeman, Parnell, Love, Hargreaves - Rutland
Maslen - Wiltshire/Victoria, Australia
Kenny - Germany
Edwards - Greater London/Victoria, Australia
Bartlett, Gee, Padbury - Northants
Rampoley, Allom - Suffolk
Detlefsen, Herse, Iversen, Boisen/Boysen - Denmark
Xylander - Germany
Dundon - Co Limerick
Mullins - Devon

Offline adela

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Re: Thomas Bowles-b c1826 Norwich
« Reply #7 on: Tuesday 19 April 11 09:41 BST (UK) »
Hi
I have just found your message asking about The Bowles family Norwich,My husband is Edmund and Ethelinda Bowles Great Great Grandson his Grandmother was Ethelinda Bowles the Daughter of John Bowles and Hannah Mace the son of Edmund and Ethelinda.
    If you would like to E-mail me at (*) i do have more information.
            Best wishes Gill.

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Offline Rochdalian

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Re: Thomas Bowles-b c1826 Norwich
« Reply #8 on: Tuesday 19 April 11 11:16 BST (UK) »
Thanks Gill, email on the way

Bob
Pearson - Yorkshire
Flinders - Notts/Lincs/Lyon
Dearden - Rochdale
Grindrod - Rochdale
Reynolds - Staffs/Cornwall
Tortoishell - Staffs
Cooper, Freeman, Parnell, Love, Hargreaves - Rutland
Maslen - Wiltshire/Victoria, Australia
Kenny - Germany
Edwards - Greater London/Victoria, Australia
Bartlett, Gee, Padbury - Northants
Rampoley, Allom - Suffolk
Detlefsen, Herse, Iversen, Boisen/Boysen - Denmark
Xylander - Germany
Dundon - Co Limerick
Mullins - Devon