DNA testing - genetic genealogy

[Tisy]

Hi,

At the risk of been shot down in flames, I am raising this question as it seems to be a topic too hot to handle on many of the Rootsweb sites.  The problem arises in that it is considered "off-topic" to even raise the question of whether you have used this method of research to supplement the more traditional methods of transcribing parish records etc.  It tends to be seen (particularly by soem of the British sites) as just an "American fad" and of not use because it doesn't actually tell you who your ancestor may be.  It is however more complex than that, and having used Y-DNA testing to help in the search for my great-grandfather's father (he was illegitimate and took his mother's name)  I have now been establish with some certainty the name of our male line, as well as where this person came from, which correlates with the scant information which I have.

I would love to be able to discuss this online with a wider range of people than those of the same surname on the dedicated sites  (we are all there, after all, because we don't know where we originated in most cases, and as with mine, we have no idea what our line is, except for a possible name.

Is there a case for having a dedicated forum on this site for this purpose, and indeed on Rootsweb?  If so, it would mean that we could draw in many people who have used DNA testing with their views, as well as others who are considering it.

Cheers,

Tisy

[msallen]

I don't see why you should get shot down in flames - the topic has come up a number of times in the past.

Personally I haven't (yet!) gained anything from it. My Y-test doesn't match with anyone at all  - either the same or different surnames, but I can see how it is potentially very useful if for example you can trace back to an immigrant (into whatever country you're in), but want some pointers as to where they came from before this.

[Berlin-Bob]

the topic has come up a number of times in the past.

You can find some of these topics under DNA testing in the
RootsChat Reference => Lexicon ^{(click here)}
(Tip: click on a category - on the right - for related topics)

Bob

[Tisy]

Hi Berlin Bob,

Thanks for the pointer - will have a look.

MSallen - perhaps you could tell me how you tested - was it just to 12 markers?  This is one of the issues that is coming up.  A 12-marker test is worse than useless, especially if you belong to a very common haplogroup as we do (R1b) - this haplogroup is the most common in Western Europe, so if you test at 12 markers only, you will come up with 100's of exact matches (all different surnames) and this is no help at all.  We tested to 67 markers;  at 12 markers we had more than 100 exact matches from all over the world.  At 25 markers it was narrowed down to four matches, (two surnames) one of which was close.  At 37 markers it was down to three close matches all of the same surname.  At 67 markers we have one close match to a person whom we share a common ancestor with 7 generations ago in Derbyshire   My illegitimate g-grandfather was born in Barnsley - just down the road, so this has been of great help to us.  This means that his g-g-g-grandfather and our match's 5-great-grandfather were possibly one and the same person.  (I hope I have that right!).  We are now trying to determine who that man may be, and further matches from Derbyshire might just do it.

Cheers,

Tisy

[msallen]

I tested at 25 markers initially, then upgraded to 37.

I have no close matches, at either level, to anyone, anywhere!

My paternal ("Y") line is also from Derbyshire. The brick wall appears in the parish of Youlgreave in the late 17th/early 18th century, when there were at least two (possibly three) families of the same name in the area - and with one family paupers, and the other descended from the lords of the manor (of nearby Stanton), the chances are they weren't closely related, if at all. I had hoped that a match might at least give me a clue as to which family I originate from, but no luck!

[clayton bradley]

Anyone who mentions brick wall and Youlgreave in the same sentence grabs my attention. My husband's Ball family stop there in the 1740s though there are earlier Balls with the same christian names. DNA testing is something I have thought of, but it might have to be a bit cheaper and a bit more certain. And we have a Sheldon as mother of a Ball wife. I think DNA testing is very interesting and I'm sure one day it will go hand in hand with other methods, claytonbradley

[msallen]

I can't disagree that it has to get much cheaper before it becomes a realistic option in many cases. I did it for interest in learning about the technology as much as anything.

I have a number of lines in and around Youlgreave, but haven't come across any Ball connections I'm afraid.

[LizzieW]

Isn't the problem that it only works with the male line? 

My brick wall is my paternal g.grandfather, but as his two sons didn't have any children only his daughter did, the next males are my father and two of his siblings.  How would DNA testing one of their sons help?  Might be a problem there though, only two left and one of the  lives in Canada somewhere and one other is incarcerated in USA .

[Tisy]

Hi all,

Msallen - you didn't mention whether you had a predicted haplogroup with your 37 marker test, and the surname of the male line tested.  Our halopgroup is R1b (the most common in western Europe and Britain);  the surname revealed by the testing is Wood/Woods.

LizzieW - yes, Y-DNA testing only works with the male line, but ftDNA is now offering a "family test" which is for either sex, and reveals close matches to previously unknown cousins etc.  The best thing to do is to join various surname projects and see what comes up in the way of matches in the various projects.  The problem is that we only started using surnames in about the mid 1200's, so very distant matches could be to other surnames.  This is why we did the 67 marker match, which narrowed it down to just one surname.  You have to also take on board that unless the people you hope to find a match with actually test, you will not find matches.  We have found that it is mainly Americans who are testing, hence our many matches to people who live in America who are descended from ancestors from the U.K.   It would be good if the British would take this on board as well, as most of us who are looking are descended from the British and due to early migration have lost contact with our families in the U.K.

It seems to be acceptable to ask someone to have the test if you suspect this is your line, as long as you do it with sensitivity, and of course offer to pay for the test.   They have the right of course to refuse.

Cheers,

Tisy