Old IRA Dublin Brigade

[johnny_doyle]

I think this is the monument you're referring to re Noel Lemass

http://www.geograph.ie/photo/466660

there was something in the papers in 2000/2001 suggesting that he had been decapitated.

From another board :

"His body was found 3 months after he had been abducted in Dublin by Sgt John O'Leary and Sgt Glynn from Rathfarnham police station. Sgt O'Leary in a report written on the day the body was discovered wrote: 'I found lying near a ditch, the remains of a man in a completely decomposed state. The skull was two yards from the rest of the body. The lower jaw was disconnected from the upper, the teeth and other small bones were scattered about'. Sgt O'Leary's report continued: 'In the vest I found rosary beads, an eyeglass and the glass of a wristlet watch. The hip pockets of the pants were turned out as if they had been searched'. "

[Private 1st class]

 3rd Battalion had quite a lot of Companys. I know they had a K coy. In 1914 the 3rd Battalion, Dublin Brigade, Irish Volunteers, had its Headquarters and a Drill Hall at 41, York St , and a large enclosed space had been secured off Camden Row for open air drill. Anyone know this spot. Must be built on now a days. Then the split came. the 3rd moved to a large premises at Lower Pembroke Street. Any got a photo in a box somewhere?,There were only five Battalions in the Dublin area as far as I know. They set up a .22 range in this place and members had to fire a number of rounds per month. In 1915 at the All Ireland Competition held out in Rush, Co Dublin. It was C company of the 3rd Battalion that won the cup. I have not got the names of the team. More the pity. The silver cup was presented by Bolands Ltd.Forthy years ago I was told that the Company still holds the cup. Anyone know of such a cup?. It would be a nice find. The main job of the 3rd Battalion at the burning of the Custom House was to take over the Fire Station at Tara St, They were to hold the Staff till the fire took hold. This they did. They had other jobs of a smaller nature but important ones. They had some six to eight men from the 4th Battalion to beef up the posts outside as far as the westland row station.Private 1st Class.

[Private 1st class]

Hi, Some names from the 3rd Battalion, Dublin Brigade,
Lt James  Bird,   Capt Seamus Brogan, Staff-Capt Thomas Cullen, (F.R.I.A.I.), Capt Henry O'Farrell,  Lt Frank Gallagher Lt Liam Lucas, Ned Devitt, Bob O'Donnell, Peter Keating George Hogan,  Sean McCluskey,  Stephen Coates,Jimmy Keegan,  Billy Redmond, Jim Boyce,  Jimmy Maher,  Billy Charles,  Jim Kinsella,   Tom Burke,  Paddy roberts, John Fynes, Jim (Kruger) Smithers . Mick White,  F ( bONER) Lawor, Sean Kavanagh,  Jim Boyce,  Jack O'Connell, Christy Grimes,  Sean Breen, Leo Purcell,  Sean Harpur,  Frank Birmingham, Ned Davitt. Arthur O'Sullivan, Paddy Hardiman,  from Private 1st class..

[seanod]

Does anyone know anything about the role of E Company of the Second Battalion in the Bloody Sunday Assassinations? According to T Ryle Dwyer's book on the Squad, Slattery, Keogh and six men from that company took part in the killing of Mahon/Angliss in Mount Street. He mentions Frank Teeling, who was captured, McClean who was also shot but escaped, and Jim Dempsey but that still leaves at least three who entered the house and also a picket outside which captured and killed two Auxiliaries (the first killed in the War of Independence), which might also have been from the same company.

[Ms. Smokestoomuch]

Hi Seanod
My grandfather was in E company and on his pension he says he was involved in Bloody Sunday. No details. So I don't know if it was a minor activity or what.
He didn't agree with the levels of violence on the day. So my mother really couldn't believe it was on his pension.
But Todd Andrews also, I think may have been one of these men not accustomed to these assassination type squad activities that got roped in on the day. He too found the behavior of the groups on the day hard going.
The only other clue to what sort of things my grandfather got up to was that he bound and gagged Detective O'Brien at his home. They searched him and found papers relating to IRA members and they warned him if he continued he'd be shot in the street if he continued his investigations. So to me that sound like a sorta run up to assassination in the men's homes. But still a very different thing.

I really really want to solve this mystery he left us.
I'm not 100% if Todd Andrews was E Company, but I think so. But it struck me that he came away from it with the same feelings about it as my Grandfather.

[seanod]

Hi Ms Smokestoomuch, I'm sure you've seen the stuff in the T Ryle Dwyer book about Todd Andrews and his being disgusted by the methods used by the people who were with him on a raid in the Ranelagh Road. He said that the two Squad men, Dolan and McDonnell "behaved like Black and Tans." The reason why I'm interested in this is that my great-uncle was taken by the Auxiliaries, beaten up and thrown into the Liffey at the beginning of February 1921, so it seems likely that he had been involved in something before this to attract the attention of informers. As he was in E Company, the Mount Street attack seems the most likely thing but there is no evidence either way, and as he was killed in the Custom House he didn't leave any witness statements or pension applications. The only chance is that someone might have left a few clues in one of the other witness statements, but Slattery is the only one who definitely left a witness statement. I looked at it for Custom House stuff but I didn't check to see what he says about Bloody Sunday. I'll let you know if I find anything in my research!

[Ms. Smokestoomuch]

Yes I went through that part of the book with a fine tooth comb.
The other thing that might be worth remembering is how many target on the day failed. I think the night before the list had about 35 named targets and it got reduced to around 25. And out of that there was a lot of assassinations that were fumbled or didn't work out.  So with the information being scant for those targets that they got, there is probably a lot more not written about that were failures. So if men were involved in a hit that was a disaster, say between nerves and inexperience, they may have preferred not to pass on the story of their experience.
And while there were people like Vinni Bryne there were probably a lot without his experience or his attitude.
One guy shooting his reflection in the mirror, tells a lot about what some were going through on the day.

[seanod]

That's very true. I notice that the raid which Todd Andrews took part in was supposed to be the preserve of the fourth battalion - I don't know if that means that Andrews was in the fourth battalion himself? I have noticed that frequently people are not where they were supposed to be in terms of their companies and battalions - during the Custom House the second battalion were supposed to be inside and the first battalion outside, but there seem to have been as many second battalion people among the pickets.

[corisande]

I am a bit lost as to the actual names of the relatives of

Seanod and Mssmokestoomuch

who were in E Company and are believed to have been involved in Bloody Sunday. It would be really useful if they could put them here.