Author Topic: Herward or Hereward of the Hollymount/Roundfort area  (Read 13137 times)

Offline ROC

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Herward or Hereward of the Hollymount/Roundfort area
« on: Tuesday 13 September 11 18:40 BST (UK) »
I'm trying to research my GG Grandfather Patrick Herward or Hereward.

I can't find his marriage or death on family search - Irish Civil Registration Index.


He married Mary Conroy, I don't know when they married but she was born in 1836 in Frenchbrook, Lough Mask, Ballinrobe.

She died 9 May 1916, she is buried beside her husband at the old Kilcommon Cemetery, Roundfort, County Mayo.

Patrick died 13 Mar 1875 and was aged around 40 when he died in tragic circumstances.



Patrick had a brother, John. I'm thinking this may be John: https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.2/MFCT-Z9W/p1



Patrick and Mary had four children:

 
James HEREWARD
Birth 12 Dec 1865 in HOLLYMOUNT,MAYO,IRELAND
Death 23 January 1927

Patrick HEREWARD
Birth 1867 in Roose, County Mayo
Death 31 Mar 1954

Bridget HEREWARD
Birth 03 Jun 1870 in HOLLYMOUNT, MAYO, IRE
Death 1942 to 1943, [not sure about this!] Buried in the old Ballinrobe Cemetery

Mary HEREWARD
Birth 26 Jul 1872
Death 1941

I know the spouses and other info of the above children but I don't think it's needed in this thread.



The following information has been provided by a member of the Hereward family who has long-since died. He wrote a general biography of the entire extended family. Many of the dates are out by a few years as he must have been writing from memory but in general, the information seems to be correct.


Patrick's death: There was some sort of fight taking place between neighbours of Patrick's at the crossroads of Scaurdaune, Claremorris, in 1875. Patrick attempted to break up the fight and was struck in the head with a stone by one of his neighbours which resulted in his death. Apparently, he did not die immediately but his date of death is 13 Mar 1875.


I have searched through several newspapers covering that time period and did not see any mentions of the fight, or Patrick's death.

I cannot find his death on the civil register. But his gravestone reflects this as his date of death also.


In this family biography, it is believed Patrick and John Hereward had come from Scotland. He believed Patrick had come to Ballinrobe as it was a garrison town.

[I would think Hereward is more of an English name.]

Patrick resided in Davros, in a place called Capaquila. He seems to have had a different relationship with the landlords compared to the average Irish resident at that time. He was living on land owned by Landlord Lindsay Fitzpatrick of Hollymount but then had to leave that property as Fitzpatrick wanted to make a bigger farm of the land in Davros. I do not know what year this happened.

He was instead given a piece of land by Charles Ben Jennings of Mount Jennings, the Landlord over the land of Roose. He had to build his own house. John, Patrick's brother, was working for Charles Ben Jennings and he had a two-storey house in the yard of the Jennings' estate.

John was described as a good worker by Charles Ben Jennings, and managed the stock and farm well. Because of this, Jennings provided him with the two-storey house. John was buried by Charles Ben Jennings when he died.

I guess John had no wife or family of his own?



The subsequent Hereward family are all Roman Catholic, but Hereward certainly isn't an Irish Catholic name, so I would expect a change from the Protestant denomination somewhere along the way, perhaps this happened when Patrick arrived in Ireland.


The surname of Herward or Hereward is extremely rare, so I thought it would be easy to research but I couldn't have been more wrong. 

There are other Herwards showing up in Oughterard and Clonbur, Galway; I don't believe they are any relation.


I really just want to find a marriage record or death record for Patrick in the hopes that it may state his father's name, or where he came from, or something like that.

If anyone could offer any information or advice, I'd much appreciate it.
Researching: Herward / Hereward / Howard (Mayo, Galway, Scotland, England)   |   McGarry (Mayo, Roscommon)   |  Gordon (Mayo, Galway)   |  Martyn / Martin (Mayo, Galway)   |   O'Connor (Mayo)   |   O'Halloran (Clare, Mayo, Limerick)   |   Jennings (Mayo)   |   Meenehan (Mayo)

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Offline heywood

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Re: Herward or Hereward of the Hollymount/Roundfort area
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 13 September 11 20:07 BST (UK) »
Hello,

Family Search has a death for a Patrick Howard 36 yrs died 1875 Ballinrobe - that may be him.  :-\
It would only give the details of death and who registered the death. No parents names given.
His marriage would have been before civil registration so you would have to try Parish records.

Are any of the family in Mayo in the censuses? I know you said Mary died in 1916.
I was wondering if this is Mary in 1901
Mary Herward with son James in Cregmore (Lynch) townland and is there also in 1911.

There is also a Howard brother and sister in 1901 (in their 20s) in Roos 1901.  He is Herewood (transcribed as Harewood)  in 1911.

heywood
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

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Offline ROC

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Re: Herward or Hereward of the Hollymount/Roundfort area
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 13 September 11 22:13 BST (UK) »
Hello,

Family Search has a death for a Patrick Howard 36 yrs died 1875 Ballinrobe - that may be him.  :-\
It would only give the details of death and who registered the death. No parents names given.
His marriage would have been before civil registration so you would have to try Parish records.

Are any of the family in Mayo in the censuses? I know you said Mary died in 1916.
I was wondering if this is Mary in 1901
Mary Herward with son James in Cregmore (Lynch) townland and is there also in 1911.

There is also a Howard brother and sister in 1901 (in their 20s) in Roos 1901.  He is Herewood (transcribed as Harewood)  in 1911.

heywood

Oh, great find on the Howard, I would think that is most likely him. I was searching for Herwerd, Herwood, etc, but didn't search 'Howard'.

I'll have to figure out what parish they married in and see then about following up on marriage records. I would assume Ballinrobe but it's hard to know.

And yes, that is Mary and her son there in the 1901 census.

I hadn't previously spotted the 'Howards/Harewoods' in Roose, but that is my family also, the Herewards were still at that address until a couple of years ago. Good find! Thanks.
Researching: Herward / Hereward / Howard (Mayo, Galway, Scotland, England)   |   McGarry (Mayo, Roscommon)   |  Gordon (Mayo, Galway)   |  Martyn / Martin (Mayo, Galway)   |   O'Connor (Mayo)   |   O'Halloran (Clare, Mayo, Limerick)   |   Jennings (Mayo)   |   Meenehan (Mayo)

Offline heywood

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Re: Herward or Hereward of the Hollymount/Roundfort area
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 13 September 11 22:23 BST (UK) »
This is a pay site but as your name is quite rare it looks very good  :)

Mayo marriage
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline ROC

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Re: Herward or Hereward of the Hollymount/Roundfort area
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 13 September 11 22:24 BST (UK) »
I'm confused as to whether this is the same Pat in 1901 as 1911, as he could read and write in 1901 but couldn't in 1911...?

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Mayo/Kilcommon/Roos/1578843/

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Mayo/Kilcommon/Roos/706508/

Also, would it be unusual for several members of the same family to actively use different variations of the same surname?

It has always been hinted at and joked about in the family that the Herewards 'made up' the surname as they had fled from England after doing something bad.  
Researching: Herward / Hereward / Howard (Mayo, Galway, Scotland, England)   |   McGarry (Mayo, Roscommon)   |  Gordon (Mayo, Galway)   |  Martyn / Martin (Mayo, Galway)   |   O'Connor (Mayo)   |   O'Halloran (Clare, Mayo, Limerick)   |   Jennings (Mayo)   |   Meenehan (Mayo)

Offline ROC

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Re: Herward or Hereward of the Hollymount/Roundfort area
« Reply #5 on: Tuesday 13 September 11 22:26 BST (UK) »
This is a pay site but as your name is quite rare it looks very good  :)

Mayo marriage

Oh wow, I'm going to have to pay for that. I don't mind paying when I'm sure it's correct, and in this case!...

Excellent find, thank you!
Researching: Herward / Hereward / Howard (Mayo, Galway, Scotland, England)   |   McGarry (Mayo, Roscommon)   |  Gordon (Mayo, Galway)   |  Martyn / Martin (Mayo, Galway)   |   O'Connor (Mayo)   |   O'Halloran (Clare, Mayo, Limerick)   |   Jennings (Mayo)   |   Meenehan (Mayo)

Offline heywood

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Re: Herward or Hereward of the Hollymount/Roundfort area
« Reply #6 on: Tuesday 13 September 11 22:37 BST (UK) »
I'm confused as to whether this is the same Pat in 1901 as 1911, as he could read and write in 1901 but couldn't in 1911...?

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Mayo/Kilcommon/Roos/1578843/

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Mayo/Kilcommon/Roos/706508/

Also, would it be unusual for several members of the same family to actively use different variations of the same surname?
 

He made his mark in 1901 when he could read and write  :-\
There is variation in names- if they were illiterate or even semi-literate, they were relying on the enumerator to fill in the form or someone else for any written forms.
 
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline ballyheeragh

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Re: Herward or Hereward of the Hollymount/Roundfort area
« Reply #7 on: Tuesday 13 September 11 23:20 BST (UK) »
Hi,

The Herward family lived in Roose, Hollymount until relatively recent times....cant give the exact date, but the last surviving member Patrick (Pake) died in the 1990's as far as I can recall.  His children (5 of them - 3 daughters and 2 sons) have moved from the area.....you may already know this.  Patrick was a fantastic character, and was widely recognised as a great historian etc....so I take it that he wrote the history you mentioned earlier.  He also featured a couple of times on national radio (RTE Radio 1) where he contributed to documentaries of a historical nature.  One such programme dealt with Delia Murphy who was born nearby.  As far as I recall, the programme was produced/presented by Aidan O Hara (or O Hora).  You might send me a private message, as I've lost touch with the one member of the family I know well.

Let me know if I can help further.

Offline ROC

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Re: Herward or Hereward of the Hollymount/Roundfort area
« Reply #8 on: Tuesday 13 September 11 23:26 BST (UK) »
Hi there,

What a small world! Yes, Pake was my grand uncle so I knew him well, sadly I wasn't old enough to pay more attention to his information on family history at the time, but it was him who wrote the history and it has been a fantastic resource to me as he gave a great insight into the personalities of various characters in the family, including who was known to be a bit moody and who preferred to be alone with books than to encounter other people. It is so much more interesting to have this information than just a list of names and dates.

Dates don't seem to have been Pake's strong point though so I'm still working my way through correcting those.  ;D

I was too young to pay any attention to the radio programmes, but I do remember Jim Fahy visiting when I was a child and interviewing him, I believe on two occasions. I'd love to be able to hear those interviews now, if anyone happens to know where they could be located, do let me know.

I will send you a private message.

 
Researching: Herward / Hereward / Howard (Mayo, Galway, Scotland, England)   |   McGarry (Mayo, Roscommon)   |  Gordon (Mayo, Galway)   |  Martyn / Martin (Mayo, Galway)   |   O'Connor (Mayo)   |   O'Halloran (Clare, Mayo, Limerick)   |   Jennings (Mayo)   |   Meenehan (Mayo)