Author Topic: Robert Helm m Helen Beattie cc 1806  (Read 4935 times)

Offline Echovalley

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Robert Helm m Helen Beattie cc 1806
« on: Tuesday 11 October 11 08:37 BST (UK) »
Robert and Helen m cc 1806 and their son John b 1814 was born in the Scottish Borders.  The parents moved to the Highlands as shepherds and they died in the Parish of Appin in 1861 and 1859.  Their son John m Elizabeth Oliver and he was a shepherd on Skye when he d in 1875.
Scotland, ex Border; Brown, Helm, Oliver. Walker (Perth) Turner (Fife)
England, Tyler, Green (Sussex), Anderson, Pinegar, Tompkins, Hacking (Lan), Malpas (Kent)
Ireland, Casey (Askeaton)

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Re: Robert Helm m Helen Beattie cc 1806
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 11 October 11 09:38 BST (UK) »
Hi

Again as with the other post that I've answered, you're not clear about what you want to know  :-\

If you want to go further back from Robert and Helen,  their death certs would give their parents' names. These can be obtained online from www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk. It's a pay site but very reasonable.

gnu
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Offline Echovalley

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Re: Robert Helm m Helen Beattie cc 1806
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 11 October 11 21:10 BST (UK) »
I have Robert Helm's parents as William and Mary, nee Scott but have no further information on this couple.  I was hoping to hear from someone who could fill in the gaps.  I  have been in Scotland, 2005, looking for family tombstones and I couldnt find Robert or Helen's gravesite, said to be in the Parish of Appin, in Argyll.
Scotland, ex Border; Brown, Helm, Oliver. Walker (Perth) Turner (Fife)
England, Tyler, Green (Sussex), Anderson, Pinegar, Tompkins, Hacking (Lan), Malpas (Kent)
Ireland, Casey (Askeaton)

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Re: Robert Helm m Helen Beattie cc 1806
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 11 October 11 21:35 BST (UK) »
If you want to know where they were buried, it would be best to  ask for an MI look up on the Argyll board.

I think that burial grounds were noted on the earlier death certs. but, if they were poor, they might not have monuments and you'd need to get someone to look at the lair books.


gnu

Census &  BMD information Crown Copyright www.nationalarchives.gov.uk and GROS - www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk

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Re: Robert Helm m Helen Beattie cc 1806
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 11 October 11 21:42 BST (UK) »
I have had a query on an Argyll board in the past but with no answers. They had a daughter and son in law in the area as a Robert Armstrong, son in law, gave the details for the death certificates.
Scotland, ex Border; Brown, Helm, Oliver. Walker (Perth) Turner (Fife)
England, Tyler, Green (Sussex), Anderson, Pinegar, Tompkins, Hacking (Lan), Malpas (Kent)
Ireland, Casey (Askeaton)

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Re: Robert Helm m Helen Beattie cc 1806
« Reply #5 on: Tuesday 11 October 11 22:15 BST (UK) »
They seem to have moved around as they had a son, William b. Kilmonivaig (near Spean Bridge/Fort William), Inverness-shire in 19th June 1811. No daughters listed for them so far.

Do you have this entry for the  1841

Culachyreach, Boleskin and Abertaff, Invernessshire

Robert Helm, 55, ag lab, b. Scotland
Helen, 50, b. England
William, 30, ag lab. b. Scotland
Catherine Macdonald, 19, Female servant, b. Invernessshire
Janet Irvine, 14. b Invernessshire


Nothing is showing for a baptism for John (1814) - just a submitted entry of his marriage.

Only marriage showing (1800-1811) in Scotland  for a Robert Helm was this one:

17  Jan 1806 Eckford, Rox, Robert Helam and Jane Givan.

Maybe Jane died  :-\

If Helen was born England (as 1841 census), then it's likely to be in Northumberland. Who were her parents on the death cert?


gnu
Census &  BMD information Crown Copyright www.nationalarchives.gov.uk and GROS - www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk

Offline Echovalley

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Re: Robert Helm m Helen Beattie cc 1806
« Reply #6 on: Tuesday 11 October 11 22:48 BST (UK) »
Thanks for the replies.  Helen Beattie was born c 1786, christened 16 April 1786 in Castleton, Scottish borders.  Her parents were John and Jean/Jane Robson.  I think it was a mistake re her being born in England  in the 1851 census as the 1841 one says she was born in Scotland
William born 1811, Mary c 1813 (m Robert Armstrong) and John b 1814  Scottish borders (m Elizabeth Oliver from Latheron, Caithness).  Re the moving around, not sure whether he was droving in the early days as the sheep were being taken to the Highlands, later I think they settled in an area. 
Scotland, ex Border; Brown, Helm, Oliver. Walker (Perth) Turner (Fife)
England, Tyler, Green (Sussex), Anderson, Pinegar, Tompkins, Hacking (Lan), Malpas (Kent)
Ireland, Casey (Askeaton)

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Re: Robert Helm m Helen Beattie cc 1806
« Reply #7 on: Tuesday 11 October 11 23:06 BST (UK) »
There's lots of info in a book called 'The Lowland Clearances' about movement of ag workers, including shepherds. I find that social history fleshes out the BMDs and census details.   I don't have the full details at hand but can find them if you'd like.

Also, of course, there was the Cheviot and the Stag!

Some of my ancestors, including shepherds and tenant farmers,  moved from Kirkcudbrighthshire to North Wales in the 1830s.

I'll see if I can find more about your family but I've just received a wonderful photo of my Scottish 3xgreat grandmother taken in the 1860s so my mind will be on such things for a while  :)

gnu
Census &  BMD information Crown Copyright www.nationalarchives.gov.uk and GROS - www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk

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Re: Robert Helm m Helen Beattie cc 1806
« Reply #8 on: Tuesday 11 October 11 23:25 BST (UK) »
Thanks for the information.  I hadn't heard of that book but I do have 'The Drove Roads of Scotland" by A.R.B. Haldane, thanks to Amazon, and it is an interesting read.  How wonderful to have such an old photograph. 
Scotland, ex Border; Brown, Helm, Oliver. Walker (Perth) Turner (Fife)
England, Tyler, Green (Sussex), Anderson, Pinegar, Tompkins, Hacking (Lan), Malpas (Kent)
Ireland, Casey (Askeaton)