Author Topic: Restore? Colour? Highland Police photo?  (Read 3650 times)

Offline conner395

  • RootsChat Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 125
  • Northern Police Pipe Band www.norconpipeband.co.uk
    • View Profile
Restore? Colour? Highland Police photo?
« on: Tuesday 21 February 12 01:40 GMT (UK) »
Can anyone help to put a date on this photo of an unidentified group of 10 Highland bobbies? (also any restoration/colour)

I suspect that the Sergeant and 9 Constables were members of the Inverness County Constabulary (the largest force in the Highlands) but unfortunately the photo is rather too far gone to discern any detail of the insignia, other than their helmet plates have a Victorian crown on top. That in itself is intriguing, as I have never in 30-odd years of research, tracked down a helmet badge (or even a photo of pre-1890s officer in uniform)  of that force featuring a helmet. I suspect their helmet badge was an anonymous (no force title on it) device of thistle leaves with NO crown on top!

This photo, taken by D Whyte, Photographer, Inverness measures 3.75 in x 2.5 in, and is very faded and looking with a magnifying glass or scanning at very high resolution shows it to be very flaky so no hint of detail. It turned up on eBay a few years ago, being sold by a dealer in TEXAS - who (despite my earnest plea) failed to provide any background information as to how he came by it.

I know that David Whyte came to Inverness in the 1860s and the studio he set up remained in operation until  the 1970s, when it took my own wedding photos!

The helmet came in during the 1860s (Metropolitan replaced their top hats c.1864 and all other forces followed suit over the next few years), and it would have been prior to the 1880s when outer breast pockets were introduced on the jacket.

Any suggestions as to possible location (background etc) would also be appreciated

Thanks in anticpation

Dave
Dave Conner
retired police officer / force historian (volunteer)
(Northern Constabulary)
Inverness, Scotland

Researching Police History of the Scottish Highlands and Islands
(Northern Constabulary area)

Offline PrueM

  • RootsChat Honorary
  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 12,637
  • Please don't try to PM me :)
    • View Profile
Re: Date Highland Police photo?
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 21 February 12 03:45 GMT (UK) »
Hi Dave :)

1860s would fit with the very plain back of the card, and in the absence of any other datable evidence on the card or in the background or clothing of the sitters (apart from what you've noted) I think all we can say is what you've already determined - that it's from between the 1860s and the 1880s.  Not sure it's possible to narrow it down much more than that  :-\

Cheers
Prue

Offline conner395

  • RootsChat Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 125
  • Northern Police Pipe Band www.norconpipeband.co.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Date Highland Police photo?
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 21 February 12 11:39 GMT (UK) »
Thanks for that.

What I do find intriguing is the reason for the photo - the chaps are not exactly immaculately turned out, nor are they well organised or standing/sitting to attention - so it is unlikely they were there specifically for Government Annual Inspection or for the photograph.

One suspects the photographer and them came to some arrangement while Mr Whyte was there for another purpose, by which time they had already done what they were there for and could let their hair - and guard - down a bit!

In those days the Force (if indeed it was Inverness-shire) was not large - as late as 1882 the strength was only 45 (all ranks) - albeit the size of the force increased dramatically soon thereafter due to civil unrest. The force had only 3 Sergeants in 1882, based at Kingussie, Portree and Beauly, and the PCs were well spread out around the County, one per parish (including the Hebridean Islands) so having 10 officers in one place at one time would have been most unusual. An early Royal visit perhaps.

I would really love to be able to identify the location, which might explain their presence. I can vaguely make out a stone wall on the right and some form of shrubbery to the left, but would appreciate any suggestions as the object directly behind the chaps.

any thoughts/observations gratefully received - and is there any potential for restoration? Just a query at this stage - if the consensus is it would be a waste of time/effort, I won't ask

Thnaks for all your interest,

Dave
Dave Conner
retired police officer / force historian (volunteer)
(Northern Constabulary)
Inverness, Scotland

Researching Police History of the Scottish Highlands and Islands
(Northern Constabulary area)

Online jim1

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 24,472
  • ain't life grand
    • View Profile
Re: Date Highland Police photo?
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 21 February 12 11:52 GMT (UK) »
The square cornered cardstock would indicate a pre 1875 date.The simple logo on the back suggests 1860's.
1860's outdoor shots are quite rare because of the primitive nature of the equipment used.
Although it's difficult to see on this there doesn't appear to be any fore or background fuzziness typical of the 60's so I would suggest a date of early-mid 1870's.

jim
Warks:Ashford;Cadby;Clarke;Clifford;Cooke Copage;Easthope;
Edmonds;Felton;Colledge;Lutwyche;Mander(s);May;Poole;Withers.
Staffs.Edmonds;Addison;Duffield;Webb;Fisher;Archer
Salop:Easthope,Eddowes,Hoorde,Oteley,Vernon,Talbot,De Neville.
Notts.Clarke;Redfearne;Treece.
Som.May;Perriman;Cox
India Kane;Felton;Cadby
London.Haysom.
Lancs.Gay.
Worcs.Coley;Mander;Sawyer.
Kings of Wessex & Scotland
Census information is Crown copyright,from
www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/


Online jim1

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 24,472
  • ain't life grand
    • View Profile
Re: Date Highland Police photo?
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 21 February 12 12:18 GMT (UK) »
Had a look at the back & thought at first a tent but there's no ropes.The only other thing I can think of is a backdrop put there by the photographer.They may have had individual photos taken against it.

jim
Warks:Ashford;Cadby;Clarke;Clifford;Cooke Copage;Easthope;
Edmonds;Felton;Colledge;Lutwyche;Mander(s);May;Poole;Withers.
Staffs.Edmonds;Addison;Duffield;Webb;Fisher;Archer
Salop:Easthope,Eddowes,Hoorde,Oteley,Vernon,Talbot,De Neville.
Notts.Clarke;Redfearne;Treece.
Som.May;Perriman;Cox
India Kane;Felton;Cadby
London.Haysom.
Lancs.Gay.
Worcs.Coley;Mander;Sawyer.
Kings of Wessex & Scotland
Census information is Crown copyright,from
www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/

Offline conner395

  • RootsChat Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 125
  • Northern Police Pipe Band www.norconpipeband.co.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Date Highland Police photo?
« Reply #5 on: Tuesday 21 February 12 14:03 GMT (UK) »
Had a look at the back & thought at first a tent but there's no ropes.The only other thing I can think of is a backdrop put there by the photographer.They may have had individual photos taken against it.

Well spotted. Yes, it could well have been a "booth" for individual photos of Joe Public - perhaps at a Fair or Highland Games or something - and then as the event is coming to an end (bobbies being bobbies) - 'how about a group shot of us?? (hopefully at same cost as an individual shot!!)'
Dave Conner
retired police officer / force historian (volunteer)
(Northern Constabulary)
Inverness, Scotland

Researching Police History of the Scottish Highlands and Islands
(Northern Constabulary area)

Offline PrueM

  • RootsChat Honorary
  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 12,637
  • Please don't try to PM me :)
    • View Profile
Re: Date Highland Police photo?
« Reply #6 on: Tuesday 21 February 12 22:09 GMT (UK) »
The informality is not necessarily unusual - I've seen photos of colonial police forces (a bit more rough and ready than this lot!) that are similarly posed.  Might have been the fashion at the time? Who knows!

Offline conner395

  • RootsChat Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 125
  • Northern Police Pipe Band www.norconpipeband.co.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Restore? Colour? Highland Police photo?
« Reply #7 on: Sunday 26 February 12 00:55 GMT (UK) »
Thanks to all for information re dates. Would anyone please consider restoring this photo, and maybe even a wee bit colour (uniform likely to have been dark blue rather than navy/black)

I fully appreciate this may be a lost cause due to the condition of the original - but I would be grateful for any improvements you can offer. (I would not even had asked had it not been for all the wonderful work you kind folks have done in this forum)

Dave

Dave Conner
retired police officer / force historian (volunteer)
(Northern Constabulary)
Inverness, Scotland

Researching Police History of the Scottish Highlands and Islands
(Northern Constabulary area)

Offline conner395

  • RootsChat Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 125
  • Northern Police Pipe Band www.norconpipeband.co.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Restore? Colour? Highland Police photo?
« Reply #8 on: Saturday 11 February 17 23:35 GMT (UK) »
hi folks - it's been a few years since I posted this, and I am still no further forward as regards identification of the force, although I do greatly appreciate the suggestions re date period.
Sadly no-one took me up on my request for restoration/colouring.
Dave


Thanks to all for information re dates. Would anyone please consider restoring this photo, and maybe even a wee bit colour (uniform likely to have been dark blue rather than navy/black)

I fully appreciate this may be a lost cause due to the condition of the original - but I would be grateful for any improvements you can offer. (I would not even had asked had it not been for all the wonderful work you kind folks have done in this forum)

Dave
Dave Conner
retired police officer / force historian (volunteer)
(Northern Constabulary)
Inverness, Scotland

Researching Police History of the Scottish Highlands and Islands
(Northern Constabulary area)