Author Topic: Greenbaums, England to Cincinnati  (Read 6267 times)

Offline fishweb

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Re: Greenbaums, England to Cincinnati
« Reply #18 on: Monday 27 February 12 17:06 GMT (UK) »
Hi there,

Just as a matter of interest there is 3 private trees on Ancestry with Nathan B Oliver b 1835 New York.

Regards

Cathy
cheshire capper houghton malia/melia fitzgerald higgins emson groves nickson
staffordshire burns goddard lindop davenport
wiltshire dowling chandler tuff
devon cox vinnecombe-butler pearce
cornwall bersey



Census information is Crown Copyright,from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline shellyesq

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Re: Greenbaums, England to Cincinnati
« Reply #19 on: Monday 27 February 12 17:24 GMT (UK) »
I wonder if this is the birth record for the daughter Alice in the 1880 Census - http://drc2.libraries.uc.edu/handle/123456789/101433  No first name is on the birth record, and the only parent listed is Esther Oliver.

Assuming Esther's Nathan did actually die in 1862, then it looks like the 3 youngest children were born out of wedlock.  Maybe that explains why Esther may not have been totally forthcoming about her past.

Offline Joseph L. Oliver

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Re: Greenbaums, England to Cincinnati
« Reply #20 on: Monday 27 February 12 22:14 GMT (UK) »
Shellyesq:

Yes, I've had that birth record for about a year.

Well, according to my research, Ella, Albert Ellsworth, May, unknown daughter, and Alice were all born after 1863, when this soldier N. B. Oliver is shown to have died.  Up until these recent posts, I thought Nathan had died between 1868 and 1869.  In any case, yes, Esther was listed as a widow yet she was still having babies.  Since Albert Ellsworth was my great grandfather, the big revelation last year when I did the birth math was that ever since A. E. O., he and his descendants had not one drop of Oliver blood in them.

So, on Aug. 14th 1880 she marries William A. Wentworth???  Why didn't she take on his name?  Why in the WCD is she still listed after 1880 as "widow, Nathan B. Oliver"?

But then her death is recored as "Esther A. Wentworth"?

So mysterious.

Joe 


1865:  ESTHER, at 46, GIVES BIRTH TO ELLA

1873, JULY 26:  ESTHER, at 50, GIVES BIRTH TO ALBERT ELLSWORTH, in Cincinnati (Birth date is according to Aunt Rosemarie’s family record)

1875, OCTOBER:  ESTHER, at 52, GIVES BIRTH TO MAY (As listed in the 1900 Census).

1876:  OCTOBER 30:  ESTHER, at 53, GIVES BIRTH TO A DAUGHTER.  The father is not listed, and Esther is shown as living at 44 Eastern Ave.  (from birth record, Uof Cincy DRC)

1877:  ESTHER, at 54, GIVES BIRTH TO ALICE.
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Offline Joseph L. Oliver

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Re: Greenbaums, England to Cincinnati
« Reply #21 on: Tuesday 28 February 12 03:52 GMT (UK) »
So many conflicts in these records, so many maiden names:  Esther Greenbaum/Greenway/Treadway/Swing/Oliver/Wentworth????

Born in England/Wisconsin/Ohio/Illinois???

Sorry I'm complaining.  I'm trying to fit the ill fitting pieces of this Esther puzzle together.

Joe
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Offline shellyesq

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Re: Greenbaums, England to Cincinnati
« Reply #22 on: Tuesday 28 February 12 12:45 GMT (UK) »
No problem -- certainly understandable that you're frustrated! 

My total guess would be that Greenway is one of the right names, because I could see Greenway being misremembered as both Treadway and Greenbaum.  As for Greenway vs. Swing, I would guess that either (1) one is Esther's actual maiden name and one was her mother's maiden name or (2) Esther snuck in another marriage before Nathan Oliver. 

Unless you know there was definitely a separate child, I'm inclined to think that Alice was the one born in Oct. 1876.  The 1880 Census was done in June, so the 1876 baby would have been age 3 at that time.

Were there any other sightings of sister Eliza aside from the 1880 Census?  She could potentially solve the puzzle, but I guess that would be too easy.   ;)

Offline Joseph L. Oliver

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Re: Greenbaums, England to Cincinnati
« Reply #23 on: Tuesday 28 February 12 16:51 GMT (UK) »
Shellyesq:

Thanks for the sympathy.  And, I agree with your conjecture regarding Esther's last names.

Re:  Esther's sister Eliza Ann Johnson:

1877:  WCD:  441 E. Front (same address as Esther and Homer in 1876)
1878:  WCD:  21 Gilbert Ave. (same address as Esther and Homer)
1880:  CENSUS:  79 Spring St. (same as Esther). 

From this point on, there are various "Eliza/beth Johnson, widows" listed in the WCD, but I cannot determine yet if any of them are Esther's sister.  If I could get Eliza's deceased husband's name, that would help if she stuck around Cincy beyond 1887, because that year the WCD started listing the names of widow's husbands.

Regarding Alice and the unnamed child born in 1876, I'm fairly certain that I have determined the two are separate individuals, so I will re-visit that and get back to you.

Regards,

Joe

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Offline Joseph L. Oliver

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Re: Greenbaums, England to Cincinnati
« Reply #24 on: Tuesday 28 February 12 23:48 GMT (UK) »
Shellyesq:

Regarding Alice and the unknown daughter b. 1876.  You know, you are probably correct.  My only source for Alice's birthyear is the 1880 census, where she is listed as 3 years old. 

As I said, the info on that census was probably related by a neighbor unfamiliar with the family, but it's easy to guess young children's ages fairly accurately.  So, okay, unknown daughter and Alice are one in the same.

Regards,

Joe 
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Offline shellyesq

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Re: Greenbaums, England to Cincinnati
« Reply #25 on: Wednesday 29 February 12 15:02 GMT (UK) »
Have you followed the daughter Sarah from the 1860 Census forward?  If not, I took a look and found a possibility. 

On the 1880 Census, there is a Sarah Cole of the right age, born in Wisconsin, and living in Cincinnati with her husband Noah, their 2 children, and Noah's mother.  Sarah's father was listed as born in Wisconsin & her mother was born in England.  Not a perfect match, but maybe.  They are living at 70 Spring St., which is nearby to where Ethel was in 1880.

There is a birth record for Mary Jane Cole, daughter of Noah & Sarah who was born in 1874 on E. Front St.:  http://drc2.libraries.uc.edu/bitstream/handle/123456789/26654/18741225b_2.JPG?sequence=1  That might be the same/nearby address to where the family was in 1876/1877.

Could just be coincidence, but thought I'd throw it out there. 

Offline Joseph L. Oliver

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Re: Greenbaums, England to Cincinnati
« Reply #26 on: Wednesday 29 February 12 21:15 GMT (UK) »
Shelly:

Not sure which entry in the 1860 Census to look at.  I found one for an Esther Oliver in Baltimore with daughter Sarah, both born in virginia, both mulato.

And the birth record you provide the link to shows Father's name as Noah Cole, mother's name is Sarah Ellen.  It seems that they are showing her maiden name to be Ellen.

Joe 


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