Newbould in Derby

[ThrelfallYorky]

Having spent ages seeking an Ann Newbould/ Newbold b. 1855 in vain on the West riding site, because I was convinced she had been born "Darley" (She married in Yorkshire, and her first two children were born there - seemed sense to me, even though she did marry a lancastrian, William Isherwood) - I've been persuaded that it may indeed have been a "Derby" birthplace, as it crops up on several census entries for her - and I still can't find her in Derbyshire!!
 As she was born c 1855, I hoped 1861 may find her - on the marriage information she gives her father as "William Newbould" , and I'd more hope of tracing her that way than in 1871 where she might well be away from home, possibly working as a domestic servant, but no luck.
Wading through loads of parish records seems futile without a bit more detail than "Derby" - can anyone suggest a place to start?

[wozzle]

there is a ann newbold birth regd in derby in apr/may/jun 1855 vol 7b page 365
possibly her you would need to get this birth cert to be certain
you could state to only send the cert if the fathers name is down as william
i believe they make a small charge for this

[KGarrad]

1881 and 1891 censuses both state Derby, Derbyshire as her place of birth.
1901 simply says Derbyshire.

[ThrelfallYorky]

Thanks both, I'm following this up asap, the later census returns are more or less as you say. But I still can't find her, with or without father William, with or without any relation called "Joseph" on any 1861 or 1871 census, and that is really getting to me!! As KGarrad is aware, she's accounted for in Southport area from 1881 - 1911. I'd been so certain for ages that a Yorkshire marriage and surname meant a Yorkshire birth that I'd spent fruitless ages trying to "fit" any Yorkshire Ann N with father William into the frame; now I'm starting all over again back in derbyshire, accepting the census transcriptions as accurate ( where I'd battled to trace her a couple of years back, to no avail, giving up then as hopeless!). Thanks, too, wozzle.

[ThrelfallYorky]

Update: I've had kind help from "DerbysDerek" on look-up(s) for Ann Newbold b c 1855 Derby, with father William Newbold - but the three he found were all 10-15 years too old, sadly, but it was so kind.
            Her father definitely was William, she was born in 1855, but I cannot find her with parents in 1861, which seems reasonable, and "Joseph Newbold" who I think was her brother, and a witness at her wedding in 1870s, or (longer shot) in the 1871 census, where she may possibly be already in Yorkshire, in service, prior to her marriage there to William Isherwood.
            As she only died in 1933, and was highly consistent in the ages she gave in censuses ('81 - 25, '91 -35, '01 - 45, '11 - 55) I'm thinking it's she should be findable, but it's another dead end, with me missing something somewhere, but I'd like to thank again those who have kindly shared their expertise with me, and tried to help.

[acorngen]

Just out of interest how are you so sure her father was William?  If this is from the marriage certificate I wouldnt be taking that as red.  She may well have been illigitimate or she may have lied on the marriage for some other reason.  I have both in my tree

[ThrelfallYorky]

Yes, that "William" is from marriage records. We know absolutely nothing of her parents or siblings. A witness at that marriage was "Joseph Newbould" - we think he may have been a brother or Uncle.
        They married in 1874, and I was really surprised not to have been able to trace her, as she died comparatively (!) recently in 1933 in Southport.
      I suppose your suggestion concerning the marriage certificate, not taking it as read is possible.  I know names may be  invented,  or truth skated over, for propriety, on such documents, often happens - just I've not yet found any on that side of my researches that failed to check out as fully legit.
           Ages back, I thought I "had her pinned", but that Ann Newbold was a Yorkshire woman herself, rather than just living there at the time of her marriage, and we had to eliminate her after accounting for her in the years that our Ann Newbold (Isherwood by then) was safely producing the next generation in Southport, and firmly insisting she had been born "Derby" 1855 in each census.
            I found a lot of William Newbold / Newbould people listed in the Derby area, but cannot link her to any, so I'm more than a bit lost now. I'd hoped to trace a William Newbold with a daughter Ann ( or variants) in the 1861 census, at least, to give me a clue to siblings and both parents, but haven't managed a likely one, even without a convenient Joseph.
           I did wonder about seeking her in non-conformist baptism records, as her husband became very involved with the Zion (Methodist?) chapel in Sussex Road in Southport, later, although in earlier generations the family seemed to be linked to the Anglican churches in town, but have no knowledge of how to access online any non-conformist baptism records for Ann in Derby, either.
       Actually, looking at a local Southport newspaper account of his in 1925, funeral it gives their Golden Wedding Anniversary as having been celebrated the previous 21st Sept: "his death took place 12 months afterwards on the very date on which the anniversary of his 50th year of happy wedded life was celebrated"  - and that gives the date of Sept 1874, correct for the marriage, and her age then was 19. So that checks out again with the age she consistently claimed to be.
      Thanks for the thought. I just wish I could find her in her youth.

[acorngen]

Unfortunately Newbold and variants is a very common name all acorss Derbyshire.  I have Newbold in South Derbyshire and had major problems with them when I last worked that branch.  I would look at using the names from her children to link with possibles in Derby and then one by one start eliminating each.  Remember as well birth places on census are the first place they remember

Rob

[ThrelfallYorky]

Thanks, acorngenealogy, for the depressing news - I think I'd come to the same conclusion, that there were loads of Newbold/Newbould families in Derbyshire. Too many to start lurching generally round stabbing in the dark.
I appreciate the suggestion about names, to help as clues.
The names from their children  aren't a load of help - the eldest is a "Harriet", b 1876 Idle, Yorkshire (who later married a John Marshall Abram.) Then an "Elizabeth Ann", who married a Threlfall, there also seemed to be an "adopted" child for a while, Edith Parr, a "George Isherwood" born 1886 - a first name that crops up a lot on the Isherwoods, and a "Joseph Isherwood" - the first name of the Newbold witness to their marriage, but also an Isherwood name, so not a lot of help.
Apart from Harriet, all were born in Southport, lancs, so that isn't a load of help, either.
I've "got" them 1881, 1891, 1901 and 1911, safely. In 1871 William Isherwood (unmarried) is still with his parents in Southport. I can't find Ann Newbold anywhere either then (1871)or in 1861. It took ages to trace their marriage as it happened near Leeds, where William was working as a joiner.
I think you can see why I was so much hoping to find any 1861 census with father William Newbold, daughter Ann ( b 1855ish, Derby) and possibly a Joseph as a brother.....
thanks yet again, though, for your interest, and helpful suggestions.