Author Topic: Identifying this bird please... and an armiger search.  (Read 5317 times)

Offline J. Hemsley

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Identifying this bird please... and an armiger search.
« on: Wednesday 02 May 12 10:07 BST (UK) »
So far the suggestions are as follows: Crane, stork, heron, magpie, raven, crow, great bustard, pigeon. Also, there was a suggestion that the tail looks like that of a ‘barn swallow’.

Personally, I have absolutely no idea at all…I thought it looks a little like a female pheasant.

Other suggestions?

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Offline PrueM

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Re: Identifying this bird please.
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 02 May 12 10:59 BST (UK) »
Previous topic on Deciphering and Recognition Help: http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,594913.0.html

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Offline J. Hemsley

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Re: Identifying this bird please... and an armiger search.
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 02 May 12 12:37 BST (UK) »
Hi Prue,
Should I not have re-posted this? I wasn’t sure whether folks who read the ‘Heraldry…’ thread necessarily also read the ‘Deciphering…’ thread? Trying to cast a wider net, I suppose.



To the other rootschatters (including Prue):

Does anyone have a comprehensive heraldic library, and the willingness, to help me in searching for a ‘Hemsley’ armiger. Possibly with a bird (of some sort) crest :-\

Offline Rena

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Re: Identifying this bird please... and an armiger search.
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 02 May 12 13:08 BST (UK) »
From the tail and tips of wings - I think the bird is a swift.  I can't find any heraldic coats of arms with just one bird on it but I noticed when surfing the county that quite a few mentions of the swift appeared in the results.
.
Aberdeen: Findlay-Shirras,McCarthy
MidLothian: Mason,Telford,Darling,Cruikshanks,Bennett,Sime, Bell
Lanarks:Crum, Brown, MacKenzie,Cameron, Glen, Millar
Ross, Urray:Mackenzie
Moray: Findlay; Marshall/Marischell
Perthshire: Brown Ferguson
Wales: McCarthy, Thomas
England: Almond, Askin, Dodson, Harrison, Maw, McCarthy, Munford, Pye, Shearing, Smith, Smythe, Speight, Strike, Wallis/Wallace, Ward, Wells
Germany: Flamme,Ehlers, Bielstein, Germer, Mohlm, Reupke

Offline davidbappleton

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Re: Identifying this bird please... and an armiger search.
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 02 May 12 15:35 BST (UK) »
From the tail and tips of wings - I think the bird is a swift.  I can't find any heraldic coats of arms with just one bird on it but I noticed when surfing the county that quite a few mentions of the swift appeared in the results.

Given that the bird appears to be standing atop a torse or wreath, I suspect that this is a crest and not a coat of arms.  If I get the chance, I'll try looking through Fairbairn's a little later.

David

Offline davidbappleton

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Re: Identifying this bird please... and an armiger search.
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 02 May 12 15:58 BST (UK) »
Going through my 1905 copy of Fairbairn's looking for similar birds, and taking my main clues from the length of the legs (longer than many birds) and length of the neck (not so long as a heron's or stork's, but longer than a swallow's, pigeon's or crow's), I think the bird is a bustard (see Plate 102.9, below), which Fairbairn assigns to the Getham family.

This identification is, of course, tentative, because we cannot know how accurately the artist who carved the matrix for the seal followed the model.

David

Offline PrueM

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Re: Identifying this bird please... and an armiger search.
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 02 May 12 21:29 BST (UK) »
Hi Prue,
Should I not have re-posted this? I wasn’t sure whether folks who read the ‘Heraldry…’ thread necessarily also read the ‘Deciphering…’ thread? Trying to cast a wider net, I suppose.

Reposting is fine - it's just always good to let people know what work has already been done (whether or not it seems directly relevant)  ;)

Offline Neohet

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Re: Identifying this bird please... and an armiger search.
« Reply #7 on: Thursday 03 May 12 10:41 BST (UK) »
I think it may be a Dove. There are plenty of examples of this bird featuring just in the Crest rather than the Coat of Arms.

This one belonging to Robert Barkley bears a striking resemblence:

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7102/6974963202_31616f276e_c.jpg

Regards,
Matt T.
Tomlinson - Sheffield, Rotherham & South Leverton
Hellewell - Rotherham & Barnsley
Percival - Sheffield & Lincolnshire
Leverton - Sheffield & Lincolnshire
Pearson - Sheffield & Worksop
Luff - Sheffield
Lashley - Sheffield
Maddison - Durham

Offline J. Hemsley

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Re: Identifying this bird please... and an armiger search.
« Reply #8 on: Tuesday 06 January 15 13:48 GMT (UK) »
I've been comparing the bird on this seal with some examples of birds in The British Herald by Thomas Robson (1830):
Bustard (plate10 fig.48), Crane (pl 11, fig. 39) Dove (pl 12, fig. 15) & Raven (pl 11, fig. 58) all from the following :
https://archive.org/stream/britishheraldor01robsgoog#page/n340/mode/2up