Elizabeth Jenkins & John Herbert marriage and death mystery

[lazydaisy]

Wow!
That is very intriguing. Thank you very much Wilcoxon .have to think about this but will pass this on to the family who have a tree on another site with some of the samr names in it.

Am wondering now just how many ways of spelling Symonds there are

Thanks again
Diane

[wilcoxon]

Going back to the 1881 census for Martha, she now has a different status. b Pembrokeshire , in 1871 she was a widow and an Evans.

Martha Evans marr 46, wife of a mariner,
Joseph Symons 26 b Merthyr Glamorganshire
Martha Herbert 16 neice b Pontlottyn Glamorganshire

By 1891 Joseph has married Abigail, they have 3 sons, and are living with various relations in Pontypridd,
Marriages Dec 1883   SYMONS  Joseph / Gamlin  Abigail
Joseph Symons 32
Abigail Symons 28
William George Symons 6
Frederick John Symons 3
Albert Victor Symons 8/12

1901 the family are still in Pontypridd,
Joseph Symons 42 coalminer
Abigail Symons 38
William G Symons 17
Frederick J Symons 14
Olwen Symons 5
Hetty Symons 1

Information removed


There is another record, but I can`t access it. It may be the son aged 9.
 Joseph Gronow Symons , Florida Death Index, 1877-1998

I know we`re still stuck with the Herberts, but at least we know about Joseph Symons 

 
 

[wilcoxon]

I have found a  family with a photo of Joseph Gronow Symonds b 1856 on Ancestry.
Also some info on Martha Evans which is submitted by the tree owner.
Martha Gronow Evans
B:abt 1841 in Dyfed, Pembrokeshire,

1851  Carmel House St Dogmaels
Jane Evans head widow 39 proprieter of houses b Llafihangel Pembrokeshire
Mary Evans 14 dau b Penrith
John Evans 12  "
Martha Evans 10 "

Possibly living in Penrith in 1841. All born in county
Penrallt.
Thomas Evans 32 farmer
Jane Evans 30
William Evans 8
David Evans 6
Mary Evans 4
John Evans 2

 
Still just a mystery. 
 

[wilcoxon]

Another family tree on Ancestry, this has only the births of their children and the 1871 census you already have with Martha and Elizabeth.

John Herbert 
B: 1822 Bedwelty Monmouthshire   
D: 14 August 1875 Gelligaer, Glamorgan, Wales   

Elizabeth Jenkins 
B: 1826 Trefin, Pembrokeshire, Wales   
D: 1880 Merthyr Tydfil, Wales   

I would check Free BMD for death of Elizabeth Herbert , the ages are not right.

[lazydaisy]

Hi Wilcoxon
You have been very busy. Thank you so much for all your input. I think we have probably arrived at the same place at more or less the same time.
It is really good of you to be spending time on this

I am sending you a PM

Thanks
Diane

[lazydaisy]

I  have just been contacted by the tree owner on ANother site re possible relationship between Martha Gronow/Symons/Evans and Elizabeth Jenkins & Martha Ann Herbert.

The tree owner thinks there is some connection but like the rest of us - hasnt a clue what it may be 

Time to put my thinking cap back on!

Diane

[wilcoxon]

http://www.visionofbritain.org.uk/place/place_page.jsp?p_id=6100

BEAUFORT, a village in Aberystruth parish, Monmouth; and a chapelry in Aberystruth and Bedwelty parishes

I may have found John Herbert in 1861, this does seem to close enough to Bedwellty, where he says he was born in 1871. There is 4 years out in the age though.

In 1861 High St, Brithdir , Gelligaer.  (District 3 image 45)
John Herbert unm 36  lodger, miner b Beaufort Monmouthshire

1871 Deri Gelligaer 
John Herbert boarder 50 miner b Bedwellty Monmouthshire.

There are a lot of Jenkins in Gelligaer in 1861 ,  but no Elizabeth. 

I can`t seem to find Elizabeth and Martha Ann in 1871, are the names spelt exactly that way.

[lazydaisy]

Hi Wilcoxon

Elizabeth and Martha Ann Herbert were recoded in 1871 census as living at Union St Brithdir. Elizabeth is 45 years old, described as wife - this is then crossed out and 'head' inserted - place of birth is Pembrokeshire.
Martha Ann is  daughter  5 years old & born Gelligaer. (Ref No R.G.10/5387).

Agree with you on 1871 census for John Herbert plus the elder daughter Elizabeth Herbert (B.1861) lives with him also as a boarder.

The 1861 entry you found is interesting - could well be John Herbert

[lazydaisy]

Going back to Martha Gronow/Symonds/Evans .... Gronow was her maiden name, she then married George Symonds and was presumably widowed, then married Mr Evans (first name not known yet)

Under which surname would her marriage to Mr Evans be registered? would I look for Gronow or Symonds in the BMD registers?

Thanks

Diane