Author Topic: Tweedie  (Read 9164 times)

Offline AirtinHame

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Re: Tweedie
« Reply #18 on: Wednesday 14 May 14 07:54 BST (UK) »
Jane Tweedy married John Jack in 1897 and had two daughters; Janet and Mary; John died, so far as I have discovered, unmarried in 1938; William, also unmarried in 1922; Robert married Mary McMillan in 1910 and they produced at least five children; David is said to have married Mary Hood but I have found no evidence of this on SP, he died in 1939; Thomas died age ten, Alexander age twenty and James age two.


"David Tweedie born about 1845 in Ireland. First appearance in Glasgow is in a marriage record where he married Ann Robertson, also from Ireland, in 1876. He was a Brickfield Labourer and his parents are listed as John Tweedie, agricultural labourer and Martha Pendleton (I don't think they came to Glasgow as there are no records on ScotlandsPeople for them). He was a Presbyterian. He died on 18 Aug 1906.

Here's my guess; I think that he and Ann Robertson came from the same part of Ireland and arrived in Glasgow together to get married and start a new life. There are other Robertsons as witnesses on the Marriage Record so it looks like other members of her family went with them."

There are births listed for that couple:
Jane Tweedie, b. 24 may 1877, Glasgow
John Tweedie, b. 16 nov 1878, Glasgow
William Tweedie, b. 2 jun 1880
Robert Tweedie, b. 1 jun 1882
David Tweedie, b. 1 jul 1884, Glasgow
Thomas Tweedie, b. 7 may 1886, Glasgow
Alexander Tweedie, b. 24 may 1888, Glasgow
James Tweedie, b. 17 sep 1890, Glasgow

Also there are two brothers listed for David Tweedy, b. 1843:
Thomas Tweedy
William Tweedy

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Offline JAKnighton

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Re: Tweedie
« Reply #19 on: Thursday 19 June 14 20:02 BST (UK) »
So, I've made quite a few breakthroughs on this subject in the past couple of years. I apologise for not responding to all of your messages; RootsChat has not been notifying me of replies like it used to.

I discovered that David Tweedie had made a Poor Law application. I ordered a copy and there were a few enlightening facts. First of all, he was indeed born in County Down. He still gives his parents names as John Tweedie and Martha Pendleton. Still no insight on their birth or death dates, all I know is they were both deceased by the time he got married in 1876.

The most enlightening details were the descriptions of his siblings still residing in Ireland. They were described as follows;

Alexander, (married?), Carter, Belfast
John, (married?), Labourer, Lurgan
Thomas, (married?), Labourer, Moyallon
Robert, (married?), Labourer, Belfast
Eliza, single, Moyallon

He had not seen or heard from them for twenty years by the time of the application; 22nd Oct 1905.

Based on these details, I started searching through Irish records, and came to these conclusions;

Alexander Tweedy married Jane McCormick on September 29, 1859 in Banbridge, County Down. He was working as a Carman at the time. Four children have been found for the couple;

Jane Tweedy, born July 6, 1864 in Banbridge, Down
James Tweedie, born December 5, 1867 in Antrim
Martha Ann Tweedie, born January 15, 1870 in Antrim
Alexander Tweedie, born May 21, 1874 in Belfast, Antrim

John Tweedy married Margaret Kelly on November 6, 1857 in Magheralin, County Down. One child for the couple has been found;

David Tweedie, born December 27, 1865 in Lurgan, County Armagh

Thomas Tweedy was first married to Anne Willis on January 17, 1858 in Tullylish, County Down. He remarried (listed as widowed on marriage record) to Margaret Preshor on April 23, 1872 in Gilford, County Down.

-------------------------------------------------

It's been previously suggested that Martha Pendleton was actually Pentland, and that a record exists for the marriage of John Tweedy & Martha Pentland in Donaghcloney, Down on February 5, 1823. However, I have been unable to locate the record.

I have baptism records for the following Tweedy's born in Lisnafiffy near Banbridge in County Down, all the children of a John & Martha Tweedie (no maiden surname supplied); Thomas in 1832, John in 1835, Alexander in 1837 and David in 1843. It seems very likely that these children are all siblings and match up with what we know about the family. Perhaps Robert and Eliza were born between 1823 and 1832?

One snag; there also exists a William Tweedy, born in 1830 in Lisnafiffy, whose parents are John and Martha. But in this record, Martha's maiden name is supplied as Patterson. This could be a mistranscription, but there is no way of knowing for sure.

What do you all think?
Knighton in Huntingdonshire and Northamptonshire
Tweedie in Lanarkshire and Co. Down
Rodgers in Durham and Co. Monaghan
McMillan in Lanarkshire and Ayrshire

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Offline AirtinHame

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Re: Tweedie
« Reply #20 on: Friday 20 June 14 08:14 BST (UK) »
I suspect a common mistake is to assume that all Pendletons were once Pentletons and therefore originally Pentlands. Your research appears to be proving that Martha was either a Pendleton or a Patterson. The whole premise that she was a Pentland seems to be based on the claim that a marriage record exists for 1823 in Donacloney. Tracing this claim back I find it was made by a contributor to Wikitree to whom I have now written asking for the source of the information. In their search for Pentland families I suspect that more than translation from Pendleton to Pentland  has been made due to over enthusiasm on the part of researchers.

If Martha's name was Pentland rather than Pendleton and the error was misinterpretation of a verbal report of her name then one might expect the error to be corrected in Scotland where Pentland is a more common name than Pendleton. The latter name has its roots in England and a further clue may lie in the townland of Moyallon or Moyallan which was granted to a colony of the Society of Friends from England in 1685. Unfortunately there are no extant tithe records for the area so the first comprehensive survey is almost two hundred years later by which time there were no Pentlands, Pentletons or Pendletons in Moyallan. GRanted that is a survey of property owners so not comprehensive but it is all we have.

It may be worth noting the distribution of the three names in Co. Down in the Primary Valuation. All of the Pentlands were in Donaghadee, all of the Pendletons in Tullylish and the Pentletons were in Kilmore. There is evidence which suggests Pentlands in Kilmore were descended from a very old Pentland line in counties Louth and Meath so it is reasonable to suspect that the Pentletons are part of that family. Donaghadee was the main port of entry from Scotland with, inevitably, a strong Scottish contingent.

It would be interesting to know if Pendletons appear in clusters and whether these clusters coincide with clusters of Pentletons. One must ask whether later Pendletons became so as a result of a mutation of their name from Pentland through Pentleton or whether the opposite was the case.

Offline JAKnighton

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Re: Tweedie
« Reply #21 on: Friday 20 June 14 14:14 BST (UK) »
That contributor on WikiTree was me, and I got the Feb 5, 1823 marriage date from this topic. I hadn't realised the GEDCOM I uploaded to WikiTree included that fact. I usually put things like that in my 'working' database.

KatC sent me a PM about Martha Pendleton being Pentland, and for some reason I have deleted it.
Knighton in Huntingdonshire and Northamptonshire
Tweedie in Lanarkshire and Co. Down
Rodgers in Durham and Co. Monaghan
McMillan in Lanarkshire and Ayrshire

Offline AirtinHame

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Re: Tweedie
« Reply #22 on: Friday 20 June 14 14:30 BST (UK) »
Thanks for that speed response. I have sent KatC a private message in the hope that she can shed further light. Based on the evidence you have produced, however, I am more inclined to favour the view that she is a Pendleton and this line have, therefore nothing to do with the Pentlands. It also has me wondering about other Pendleton/Pentland families in the area.

Offline KatC

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Re: Tweedie
« Reply #23 on: Sunday 22 June 14 23:07 BST (UK) »
Sorry guys, but I am moving and my records are sitting beside a disconnected computer 300 miles away.  I may not be on-line with records beside me for another month.  I will look for examples of name changes when I can.  Quite a few of my families changed their spellings in minor or major ways, so I would not be surprised to see this as another example.  I understand you want several instances, so I will look through the transcribed originals I have.

Offline JAKnighton

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Re: Tweedie
« Reply #24 on: Sunday 22 June 14 23:46 BST (UK) »
Hi KatC, good luck with the move. Do you have any memory of where the record for John Tweedy & Martha Pentland's marriage came from? It seems like it's not online.
Knighton in Huntingdonshire and Northamptonshire
Tweedie in Lanarkshire and Co. Down
Rodgers in Durham and Co. Monaghan
McMillan in Lanarkshire and Ayrshire

Offline KatC

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Re: Tweedie
« Reply #25 on: Monday 23 June 14 02:52 BST (UK) »
I have a flash of  some Seagoe Pentland/Pendleton/Pentleton records, but not any from Donaghcloney. It contains transcriptions from the Seagoe book, not original handwriting, probably starting in the late 1700's.  My copies may not contain all the relevant pages and the early data  is often vague.  The researcher who gave me these pages also gave me the tree.  That data may have been data I gave to him from the questionable source. 

Seagoe records
George and Susanna Pentleton have Robert 1804 and Alexander  in Killicomain in 1811, but Robert 1807 and Elizabeth in Killicomain in 1798 are children of George and Susanna Pentland.

John and Margaret Pendleton have daughter 1828 in Ballyhannon, but Rachel Pentland died 1849 at age 20.

Alexander and Elizabeth Pentland have John b 1807 in Drumgor but Elizabeth b 1801 in Drumgor is born to a Pentleton family.  John b 1804 is born to Alexander Pentleton and wife, no location

Alexander and Mary Pentleton of Drumgor have Thomas 1829.  This appears to be Thomas Pentland who married Jane Lyness at age 21 in 1850.  Possibly the Alexander and Mart (probably Margaret with the apostrophe missing but could be Mary if the handwriting was bad) Pentland having Alexander in 1832 and Mary Jane in 1834 in Drumgor is the same person.

I suspect Samuel and Elizabeth Webb of Drumgor are another couple with a name change, but can't tell for sure. 

I have no paper for taking notes except 3x3 post-its so I am having trouble matching entries.  I can e-mail the jpegs of the Seagoe pages if someone wants to better follow this.  There are a few Pendletons, more Pentletons, and then Pentlands, lots of Edenderry Pentlands in the later dates.  These are the sort of entries that make me think the name changed. 

Offline doylers94

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Re: Tweedie
« Reply #26 on: Tuesday 25 November 14 18:02 GMT (UK) »
The David Tweedy born December 1865 is definitely mine. His parents were John and Margaret Campbell and he was baptised in Lurgan at Shankill COI This couple went on to have several more children. My great grandmother was Martha Tweedie (married David Hall) I have a theory that John was married previously to Margaret Kelly and that Martha was baptised in Magheralin COI (near Lurgan) born Edenballycoghill near Donaghcloney, Down. I suspect John Tweedies first wife died as there are no further baptisms recorded locally and he re-married prior to 1865 Margaret Campbell. The couple had the following children David 1865 John 1870, Mary 1872 Sarah Jane 1874 and Margaret Anne 1876. I currently live in this area and am happy to chase local records. Ann
Areas Lurgan and neighbouring townlands in the Parishes of Shankill and Seagoe, Toomebridge County Antrim, Queens County New York, Hartford Connecticut, Michigan USA. Names Doyle McElroy Pollock  Harte Neill Hall Mc Cully Wright Boyle Murray Mc Conaghy Mc Cann Brown Patterson Carson Hines Lauder Waters Watson Hendron Tweedy Warnock