Author Topic: James Hopkins Born 1879 County Carlow - Hopkins Family Tree  (Read 24514 times)

Offline kierandoody

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Re: James Hopkins Born 1879 County Carlow - Hopkins Family Tree
« Reply #45 on: Friday 03 November 17 07:39 GMT (UK) »
James did travel to the US (passenger records confirm) but his wife Mary passed away before he remarried. An attempt was made to have at least one of his children join him but this was effectively blocked on religious grounds.
A turbulent time to be in Ireland and we are only emerging from its dark days of religious rule in my lifetime.

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Offline Tojo65

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Re: James Hopkins Born 1879 County Carlow - Hopkins Family Tree
« Reply #46 on: Thursday 09 November 17 13:31 GMT (UK) »
I’ve been doing some more research on the Hopkins & Toole families & thought I’d share what I've found out.

James’ wife Mary was born in 1874 in Clonegal, Shillelagh, County Wicklow.

Mary TOOLE born 1st December 1874 in Clonegal, Shillelagh, Wicklow, daughter of Timothy TOOLE of Clonegal, a Sub Constable R.I.C., & Johanna TOOLE formerly LONDERGAN, registered by Timothy TOOLE, father, residing in Clonegal on 7th December 1874.

Her parents were Timothy Toole & Johanna Londergan / Lonnergan / Lonergan / Lundrigan who married in Tipperary. I have found conflicting marriage records.

Timothy TOOLE and Johanna LONNERGAN were married on 15th November 1871 by the very Rev. William Canon Hall(?) in Clonoulty, County Tipperary. They were living in Cappamurragh.

There is however also the following possible match. It is possible that the marriage in 1871 was formally registered in 1873 as the following are from the civil registers: Name: Timothy TOOLE & Johanna LONERGAN, Date of Event: 1873, SR District/Reg Area: Cashel, Returns Year: 1873, Returns Quarter: 1, Returns Volume No: 13, Returns Page No: 347.

Timothy’s police records have the following marriage date: 5 July 1873. He joined the R.I.C. aged 19 in 1866 in Tipperary & was posted to County Carlow a few months later where he remained until his death as a retired police sergeant in 1901.

Timothy TOOLE death 18th July 1901 in Tullow, Carlow, married, aged 57, a Police Pensioner, Cause of Death: Heart disease, 3 years, registered by Thomas TOOLE, son present at death, residing in Tullow on 24th July 1901.

His wife died in 1907:

Johanna TOOLE death 19th November 1907 in Tullow, Carlow, widow, aged 54, a Policeman’s widow, Cause of Death: Apoplexy, 13 days, registered by Thomas TOOLE, son present at death, residing in Tullow on 20th November 1907.

It is odd that their 1st child should be born in Clonegal, Shillelagh but perhaps they had temporary lodgings there. Their other 6 children were all born in Tullow (John 1877, Timothy 1879, Thomas 1881, Michael 1883, Anastatia 1887 - died shortly after, James Christopher 1890).

I have located all 7 of the children of James Hopkins & Mary Toole which ties in with the 1911 census (7 children born alive, 6 of which were still living).

Looking at the 1901 Census James & Mary’s eldest child, Mary, was aged 11 so she must have been born in 1899. James & Mary married in May 1900 so clearly Mary‘s daughter would have to be illegitimate & this is the reason that no registration for a birth of a Mary HOPKINS can be found. She was in fact registered as Mary TOOLE. Whether James was the father is unknown.

1) Mary TOOLE born 17th February 1899 in Tullow, Carlow, daughter of Mary TOOLE, registered by Eliza POWER,
nurse, present at birth in Tullow on 20th February 1899.

2) James HOPKINS born 16th October 1900 in Tullow, Carlow, son of James HOPKINS of Tullow, a Cooper, & Mary HOPKINS formerly TOOLE, registered by James HOPKINS, father, residing in Tullow on 5th November 1900.

James died aged 18 days.

James HOPKINS death 3rd November 1900 in Tullow, Carlow, aged 18 days, a Cooper’s child, Cause of Death: Weakness from Birth, registered by James HOPKINS, father present at death, residing in Tullow on 5th November 1900.

3) Margaret HOPKINS born 3rd January 1902 in Tullow, Carlow, daughter of James HOPKINS of Tullow, a Labourer, & Mary HOPKINS formerly TOOLE, registered by Mary HOPKINS (her mark), mother, residing in Tullow on 17th January 1902.

4) Sarah HOPKINS born 17th March 1903 in Tullow, Carlow, daughter of James HOPKINS of Tullow, a Cooper, & Mary HOPKINS formerly TOOLE, registered by Johannah TOOLE (her mark), present at birth in Tullow on 17th April 1903.

Johannah TOOLE is probably Mary’s mother.

5) James HOPKINS born 26th June 1904 in Carlow Workhouse, Carlow, son of James HOPKINS of Tullow, a Cooper, & Mary HOPKINS formerly TOOLE, registered by W PELLORROW, Occupier, Workhouse on 28th July 1904.

It is unknown why James was born in the Workhouse.

6) Annie HOPKINS born 31st May 1906 in Tullow, Carlow, daughter of James HOPKINS of Tullow, a Labourer, & May HOPKINS formerly TOOLE, registered by May HOPKINS, mother, residing in Tullow on 13th June 1906.

7) Nicholas HOPKINS born 10th January 1908 in Tullow, Carlow, son of James HOPKINS of Tullow, a Labourer, & Mary HOPKINS formerly TOOLE, registered by May HOPKINS, mother, residing in Tullow on 21st February 1908.

I have not been able to find Mary’s death in the records but it must have been after the 1911 census & before James remarried in the U.S.

Perhaps someone can help me find her death? Any other information would also be fascinating to hear.

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Offline dathai

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Re: James Hopkins Born 1879 County Carlow - Hopkins Family Tree
« Reply #47 on: Thursday 09 November 17 14:05 GMT (UK) »
Policemen were bound by certain criteria.
While helping someone else here on RChat i came across a few rules sorry i cant find them now however most policemen had to get permission to marry and they had to produce a certain amount of money before marriage to prove they could keep up payment of rent etc to sustain a family,most single men lived in Barrack's and shared their expences with each other as their wages were not very good though it was a pensionable job.
Also policemen could'nt serve in his or his wife's native county.
Some of the above could explain the 2 marriages i e permission needed before recognition of marriage.

edited to add
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01kgn/

Offline dathai

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Re: James Hopkins Born 1879 County Carlow - Hopkins Family Tree
« Reply #48 on: Thursday 09 November 17 15:24 GMT (UK) »

Offline dathai

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Re: James Hopkins Born 1879 County Carlow - Hopkins Family Tree
« Reply #49 on: Thursday 09 November 17 17:58 GMT (UK) »
1866 to 1873 7 years the length of time an R I C constable would have to serve before gaining permission to marry.

Offline Tojo65

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Re: James Hopkins Born 1879 County Carlow - Hopkins Family Tree
« Reply #50 on: Friday 10 November 17 16:34 GMT (UK) »
Thanks for the tip about the 7 year rule Dathai. I found some more information on the R.I.C. Code on the Royal Irish Constabulary which was very interesting. I expect that Timothy & Johanna would have had to try to keep their marriage in 1871 a secret.

Re: Mary Hopkins' death in 1917, I can't find a match with any of my family so I don't know who she was. And none of the oher Mary's match James' wife. It's all a bit odd.

Offline Ross Hopkins

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Re: James Hopkins Born 1879 County Carlow - Hopkins Family Tree
« Reply #51 on: Friday 08 December 17 04:12 GMT (UK) »
James Hopkins of Tullow was a son of Nicholas Hopkins and Margaret McWilliams.

Offline Tojo65

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Re: James Hopkins Born 1879 County Carlow - Hopkins Family Tree
« Reply #52 on: Tuesday 12 December 17 14:28 GMT (UK) »
Hello Ross,

I posted that information on Sunday 03 January together with other information concerning the Hopkins & Toole families....

Offline Sarah Hopkins

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Re: James Hopkins Born 1879 County Carlow - Hopkins Family Tree
« Reply #53 on: Sunday 18 March 18 11:18 GMT (UK) »
I have just joined this site after a discussion with my father Eric Hopkins and a quick google search concerning our ancestors in Tullow County Carlow and the United States. Eric's father (my grandfather) was Benjamin Hopkins a cooper with the Guinness brewery, son of Robert also a cooper, and grandson of Nicholas by his first marriage. My dad was really surprised and delighted to see a post from Jack's daughter. We have old letters/correspondence between Jack and his older half brother Robert (my great grandfather) who Jack refers to in his letters as Bob . Jack was planning a trip to Ireland in 1947 to meet his half brother Bob Hopkins in County Dublin. Bob had arranged to meet Jack at a railway station and Jack was going to wear a red rose in his lapel, so they would recognise each other. However, a later letter arrived from Jack to say he had to abandon his trip to Ireland due to medical issues relating to his stomach. Contact was then lost as Robert Hopkins died in late 1947. Although we have found a subsequent letter addressed to my father's aunt Charlotte Hopkins, Robert's youngest daughter dated 1949. My father Eric did attempt to make contact with his relatives in the late 1970's in upstate New York (pre the internet age) via a phone book when he was visiting there but failed.
We would love to hear from Jack's relatives. My father has fond memories as a little boy of the excitement when letters and packages arrived, gifts from Uncle Jack to his half brother, cigars and tobacco in coloured canisters which were impossible to get in post war Ireland.
It would be lovely to hear from any of our relatives as my father has a keen interest in his ancestry.