Hay Family Dead End

[kb0fhp]

I am not sure where to proceed from here.

I have been working diligently on the Hay family and have made fair progress. 

I have been trying to gather the ancestors of William Hay born 1787 in Duffus.  I gathered his baptism record and death record and was able to determine that the parents were James Hay b 06 March 1760 and Elspet Forsyth b 1760.  Her father was William Forsyth from the baptism record of her son William.  From the baptism record of James Hay, I was able to determine that the parents were William Hay and Margaret Forbes.  From the baptism record of James, there was a witness of James Hay (I suspect William's father) in Orlage and James Forbes (I suspect Margaret's father) in Nether Dalachie.  William and Margaret Forbes married 23 Dec 1755 in Bellie, Moray (both of that parish).  They had the following children in order:

Janet Hay 1756
Isabell Hay 1757
James Hay 1760
Margaret Hay 1760 (twin of James)
John Hay 1783
Helen Hay 1768.


Following typical naming convention, Margaret's mother would likely have the first name of Janet.  I do a search of James Forbes and Janet. and I determine that James Forbes and Janet Gordon had a child Margaret 14 October 1733 in Bellie Moray.  So far so good.

Thinking that they are following traditional naming convention (and they had for several generations previous like clockwork), the father of William Hay would be James (he appears on the baptism of James Hay 1760), and the mother of William would likely be Isabel. 

I perform a search on Familysearch.org and find a James Hay and Issabell Allan in Urquhart, Moray - not too far from Bellie (under 5 km across farmland).  They have children born all in Urquhart, Moray:

Christian 1731
James 1734
and Joesph 1735.

No William (I suspect that he would be born about 1733).  No luck.  I search SP Moray records - and only find a record for a James Hay and Jean Nichol, with the birth in 1727.  I also checked the Moray libindex with no luck (but I have never had much luck with that).

Several questions - Where is Orlage Moray?  I can't seem to find it.  The only references I find are associated with clocks. 

How do I proceed now - I appear to be at a dead end with the Hay family.  They appear to be related to the Hay Family of Cummingston:

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,538155.0.html

Not sure where to proceed.

Thank you for all your help

Scott

[GR2]

Perhaps you have misread the place "Orlage". The National Library of Scotland has an excellent (free) maps website which will allow you to view old maps of Scotland. These include Roy's fairly detailed map of 1747-1755 and large scale Ordnance Survey maps from the 19th century. Have a look at them and they may throw up something.

[Forfarian]

I agree with GR2, there is no such place in Moray. Orton and Orbliston do spring to mind, but if the 'O' is wrong I can't think where it might be.

If you can post an extract of the original record that contains 'Orlage', we might have some ideas what it might be.

[kb0fhp]

Here is the record - I think I properly extracted it.  I looked at other letters, and "O" seems the most likely.

[Forfarian]

Yes, it looks clear enough. So we are looking for a place that no longer exists, and if it is near the rest it is somewhere in the parish of Bellie.

[kb0fhp]

I looked Orlage up in Jamison's :  http://www.electricscotland.com/history/jamieson/

Apparently this is an old dictionary of the Scottish language showing usage.  It is related to a clock face - perhaps a clockmaker?  Or the clock itself?  Living in a clock tower?

Not sure what to make of this.....

[GR2]

I have had a look at the old maps of Bellie and Orlage does not show up at all. There is a place called Ordiga to the south of Auchenhalrig, that's the closest I can see.

[Forfarian]

Likewise.

Ordiga is a bit vague as it is part of the forest. There might have been a farm or croft there at one time, but even if there were, the writing in the extract is quite clear.

http://www.geograph.org.uk/search.php?i=36374721

[kb0fhp]

I am wondering if the record was showing occupation as a clockmaker instead of a residence. 

There are a series of clock makers in Scotland from the book Old Scottish clockmakers from 1453 to 1850 (1921) by Author: Smith, John, clock-maker http://archive.org/details/oldscottishclock00smitrich which is available through archive.org