HARTOM perhaps HARDHAM?

[supermoussi]

A Dame BRAN was paid £2 3s 0d for keeping Elizabeth TISEHURST 43 weeks in Mar 1761; William TISEHURST was farmed out to two different farmers in Wellingham, Ringmer, 1765-1766, generally at a cost to the parish of a shilling a week, while a James TISHURST was put out to a different farmer at 2s 0d per week up to March 1766; was in the workhouse [James TISORS] in May 1766 and farmed out again in 1772 [at 1 guinea for the year] to one of the same Wellingham farmers who had previously taken William. These look like children of William & Barbara, farmed out after Barbara's death in 1762.

William & Barbara baptised Elizabeth in 1748 and William in 1755 but no James as far as I am aware, or have I missed him?

William's brother James (1729-   )could be the James TISEHURST advertising lime for sale from a South Malling chalkpit in the 26 Apr 1773 Sussex Weekly Advertiser. His string of baptisms of children at Ringmer ends in 1769, and he figures in Colin Brent's book 'Georgian Lewes'.

Now that is interesting. As you say James bap.1729 vanishes from the Ringmer registers after 1769 and I wondered where he went. Probably worth checking out the South Malling BMDs to see if his family appear in them.

Curiously William TICEHURST & Barbara HARTOM's grandson, William TICEHURST b.1798 Willingdon worked as a Limeburner in the 1820s and then again in the 1860s to 80s. How large was the Lime industry in the area? If it was a fairly niche field could it be that William TICEHURST b.1798 was introduced to Limeburning by some family connection to James TICEHURST the Lime seller?

Does Colin Brent's book say much about James?

[Fairmeadow2]

Like you, I was surprised by the Mary FRIEND administration. As administration was granted to her 'natural brother' John FRIEND, she was presumably considered unmarried at her death.

Colin Brent, doyen of Lewes historians, still lives in Lewes & is in the phonebook. In Georgian Lewes p.30 he simply refers to James TICEHURST as working an ancient pit off North Street, Cliffe, which later became an overspill graveyard for Cliffe parish. Cliffe is today part of Lewes, but was then administratively separate, across the Ouse from Lewes proper. Cliffe is surrounded by South Malling parish.

There are large Victorian chalk pits all along the South Downs, but especially where the Downs are cut by the rivers, such as the rivers Ouse (Lewes, South Malling, Glynde, Beddingham, South Heighton) & Cuckmere (Wilmington). These have devoured the traces of most of the smaller, earlier, pits.

James TISEHURST (various spellings) is amerced as a brickmaker in every manor of Ringmer pannage court from 1690-1715 (nominally a fine, this was in reality a licence to dig clay to make bricks for sale from the Broyle common. He appears in the views of frankpledge in Norl;ington borough, Ringmer, nearly every year from 1691-1719, the period for which these records run. He was chosen headborough of Norlington in 1704, and was the alternate nominee for this role in 1695, 1698, 1703 & 1715. In Jun-Sep 1722 "Tisehurst" supplied bricks to the owner of Glyndebourne [account book in the Glyndebourne records held in the PRO after a 19th century Chancery case]. However, he had a range of accomplishments. The Earl of DORSET's steward's accounts for 1696-1712 note James TICEHURST as one of three men paid for cutting down posts and rails for the Broyle boundary fence in 1697-8, and in 1701-2 he was one of a group of men paid for work done about one of the lodge's that housed the Broyle keepers [ESRO/Acc.3610].

Never seen this James TISEHURST in this context, but several of the other Ringmer brickmakers supplied not only bricks but also the lime to make the mortar to fix the bricks together. I suspect they could lay their bricks too, and do the associated carpentry should the need arise. Such men were pretty resourceful, but you don't see the term 'builder' much before the 19th century.

[Fairmeadow2]

The parish register entries for the children of James TISEHURST (1659-1713 or -1730) are very informative.

On 18 Nov 1683 the vicar records the baptism of the illegitimate twin sons, John & James, of Elizabeth APTOT, wife of John APTOT, in the absence of her husband, who had not cohabited with her for over 11 years. One James TISHURST acknowledged he was the father. One of the twins, John, was buried in 1684, as John APTOT alias TISHURST, one of the illegitimate children of James TISHURST. Then on 21 Feb 1685/6 John the illegitimate son of Elizabeth APTOT was baptised, with James TISHURST again acknowledging he is the father. The other children Elizabeth (bapt 24 Apr 1688) and William (bapt 31 May 1691) are simply baptised as the children of James & Elizabeth TIS(E)HURST. The two James TYSEHURSTs buried on 9 Mar 1712/3 & 11 Jun 1730 are presumably the surviving twin and his father (not necessarily in that order). The vicar in 1730 made a practice of noting the occupations of the adult men he buried, and James TYSEHURST is called a labourer.

[supermoussi]

James TISEHURST (various spellings) is amerced as a brickmaker in every manor of Ringmer pannage court from 1690-1715 (nominally a fine, this was in reality a licence to dig clay to make bricks for sale from the Broyle common. He appears in the views of frankpledge in Norl;ington borough, Ringmer, nearly every year from 1691-1719, the period for which these records run. He was chosen headborough of Norlington in 1704, and was the alternate nominee for this role in 1695, 1698, 1703 & 1715. In Jun-Sep 1722 "Tisehurst" supplied bricks to the owner of Glyndebourne [account book in the Glyndebourne records held in the PRO after a 19th century Chancery case].

Thanks fairmeadow. Very interesting 

I had assumed that James Snr died in 1713 and his son James APTOT als TICEHURST died in 1730, but bearing in mind the pannage records it does look quite possible that it was the other way around.

Do you know what typical ages of headboroughs/constables were? James Snr would have been 55 when the last James TICEHURST was nominated in 1715; a bit old to be running around catching sheep rustlers perhaps, but maybe that was why he wasn't chosen that year? James Jnr was definitely too young in 1695, ie 12, but would have been 32 by 1715, probably a good age to be a constable?

I guess if James Jnr took over brickmaking from James Snr the records may be mixing them both up?

[Fairmeadow2]

Once they are both called James TISEHURST I don't think there is an obvious way of distinguishing them.

Headboroughs are not usually elderly, and often but not always fairly young. I have noticed they are quite often newly arrived farmers or newly married men. Some are fairly well up the village social scale, farmers or prominent village tradesmen, but others of pretty modest status (e.g. "husbandmen" or labourers). I guess the reason they had to be married was that to do the job efficiently there had to be someone at home who could say where they were to be found when they were needed. I don't think wives got out much.

[supermoussi]

Thanks fairmeadow. 

I guess when it came to having to deal with potentially violent/armed troublemakers it would be a case of who draws the shortest straw got the dubious honour. Being stuck at home might not have been such a bad option!

Quite a few Ticehursts were quite tall, I think one may have been closer to 7ft than 6 ; probably a characteristic that would come in handy dealing with scallywags

Are the Ringmer pannage records available in book/pamphlet? Might add it to my crimbo list.

[Fairmeadow2]

I'm afraid the pannage courts are still in the original handwritten format in the manor court books. In Latin, even!

[supermoussi]

Ok, Thanks for all your help Fairmeadow 

[Lisa B]

Thomas Tisehurst  =  Mary Picknell   28 Nov 1626 Burwash

Thankfull Tisehurst  =  Susannah Wood   May 15th 1662 Burwash

Thankfull Tisehurst  =  Mary Kidder   26 Apr 1694  Parish of Little Horsted East Sussex, England daughter of John Kidder and Mary Bunger Maresfield.