John Ellis

[coralreef]

My John Ellis and Mary Quick I have on three census  with the name Ellis or Ealis
1871
1881
1891
My Great grand mother is on these census her name was Ann Quick Ellis
On John and Mary marriage certificate in 1856 it was written that
John Hollow was deceased
Coralreef

[JaneyCanuck]

.................. And you have noticed that I provided you with your John and Mary Ellis and their children in the 1861 census where their surname is in fact HOLLOW?

Once more for good measure:

John Hollow 23 tin miner, born St Just
Mary Hollow 26, born St Ives
John Quick Hollow 4
James Quick Hollow 2 (in the Ellis household in 1861)
Paul Quick Hollow 1

These are your greatx2 grandparents and their children, right?

The conclusion is that John Ellis's mother Elizabeth Ellis married John Hollow after her son was born, and John Ellis was reared as the son of his mother and his stepfather, and used the stepfather's surname informally as his public name.

This was not at all uncommon.

If you want more info about Elizabeth Ellis, you need to get the Ellis-Hollow marriage certificate. I actually spent quite a bit of time searching the images of parish marriages at FamilySearch in Sancreed, St Just and Towednack and didn't find it, so it must have been somewhere else in Penzance district and I was searched out.

John Hollow might even have been John Ellis's real father. No way of knowing at this point, unless you can find any of them in the 1841 census and they are living together before the marriage of Elizabeth Ellis and John Hollow, for example. I have not had any luck identifying Elizabeth and John Ellis in 1841.


"Ealis" in 1871 is a spelling error (that could have happened when the name was copied from the household schedule). This is why I asked whether you are in touch with the two people who have corrected that error at that site, who may know something about the family (although from their profiles/trees they do not seem to be related).


You're very welcome.

[coralreef]

I have found one marriage of a John Hollow and Elizabeth Ellis in 1843
on ancestry at Penzance I hope this is correct thankyou for all the help

[JaneyCanuck]

That's the one I posted in post #8 --

An Elizabeth Ellis married a John Hollow, Jun Q 1843, Penzance reg dist, which covers Sancreed and St Just.



The problem is that with John Hollow being deceased by 1856 when your man married, there is only one opportunity to find him and Elizabeth together in the censuses: 1851. And if one or both of John and Elizabeth had died before that, then they will never appear in a census together. Unless they were living together in 1841 before their marriage.

It's just too hard to be certain about any Elizabeth or John Ellis in 1841 -- not even clear where to look for them (Sancreed, St Just, Towednack ...).

And before 1856 when John Ellis married, the age of the deceased isn't shown in the GRO index for deaths, so it's hard to identify John Hollow's death, or Elizabeth's, if she died before then too.

So -- that 1843 marriage certificate could be very helpful, to know their places of residence and father's names, and John Hollow's occupation (shall we guess miner?).

If they are together in 1841, it might be that John Hollow was John Ellis's father and there was some reason he and Elizabeth couldn't marry before 1843.

[coralreef]

It does get complicated I will send for the marriage certificate it may help

[thomasjames88]

Hi Guys, here is the 1843 marriage as follows -

http://www.cornwall-opc-database.org/search-database/more-info/?t=marriages&id=1254113

[JaneyCanuck]

Should I smack my head or was that record not available in 2012?

John Hollow was a widower when he married Elizabeth Ellis. I don't see an obviously matching death in the area for a wife of John before 1843. It could be that he wasn't free to marry until 1843 ...

Meanwhile this baptism of John Ellis with mother Elizabeth, base born, in 1834 in St. Just in Penwith
http://www.cornwall-opc-database.org/search-database/more-info/?t=baptisms&id=3272715
matches my hypothesis:
'The conclusion is that John Ellis's mother Elizabeth Ellis married John Hollow after her son was born, and John Ellis was reared as the son of his mother and his stepfather, and used the stepfather's surname informally as his public name.'

She may also have had son William in 1838:
http://www.cornwall-opc-database.org/search-database/more-info/?t=baptisms&id=3273680

They could well be the children of John Hollow if John was not free to marry.

In 1841 in Sancreed there is a household with a John Ellis aged 7 and a Mary Ellis aged 70.

In 1841 in Buryan (John's residence at the time of the 1843 marriage) there is a John Hollow aged 45 with wife Jane aged 50 and son John; the image at Ancestry is basically illegible (very bottom on right-hand side).

Jane Hollow aged 51 was buried in St Buryan in November 1841:
http://www.cornwall-opc-database.org/search-database/more-info/?t=burials&id=680576

I suspect that is the John Hollow in question who married Elizabeth Ellis in 1843 -- and again:

'The conclusion is that John Ellis's mother Elizabeth Ellis married John Hollow after her son was born, and John Ellis was reared as the son of his mother and his stepfather, and used the stepfather's surname informally as his public name.'

[coralreef]

Thank you for all the information on John Ellis he was my great great grandfather thanks again       coralreef