Author Topic: Dalgarno of Aberdeen  (Read 21115 times)

Offline francestogneri

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Dalgarno of Aberdeen
« on: Monday 19 November 12 12:18 GMT (UK) »
I am using a combination of Ancestry and scotlandspeople but have reached a point of confusion.  I found online trees showing William Freeman Ruddiman as a Burgess of Aberdeen although I don't think their tree is the same as mine unless there is a sibling connection.

William was born about 1801 in Aberdeen and married Jean or Jane Dalgarno on 17 September 1865 at the bride's house by the minister from Shiprow Church (Old Relife Church?).  I have documents and census info to confirm I have the correct woman.  William's death cert (28 Jan 1860 in Aberdeen) gives Joseph Ruddiman and Elspet Freeman as parents.  The trees I found on-line show Elspet Freeman married a Joseph Munro, not Ruddiman.  Joseph Ruddiman's father may also have been Joseph (born 17 March 1729 at Monquhitter(?) to James Ruddiman).  

Jean's parents (her death 17 Sep 1865 in Aberdeen) are William Dagarno and Margaret Runciman.  Like someone else, I find the lack of sibling information for this period a problem.

Can anyone confirm whether William was indeed a Burgess of Aberdeen or throw some light on the people mentioned?   Frances

Offline MonicaL

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Re: William Ruddimanand Jean Dalgarno
« Reply #1 on: Monday 19 November 12 13:18 GMT (UK) »
Hi Frances

Welcome to RootsChat  :)

Someone else here on RC researching the Dalgarno family, see http://surname.rootschat.com/sit-surnames.php?chatter_id=59969  She has only posted once, http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,304214.0.html

On the Dalgarno family, is yours one of the trees on a/try?

Can only see so far one record for a sibling for Jean (born https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XBQ3-8KM) - a sister Barbara (married George Harris died after the 1881 census?) http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,304214.0.html

People have likely (hopefully!) confirmed other siblings for Jean via their death certs, such as the likely sister Margaret born c. 1808 who married a Norman Meldrum and died in the 1880s in Scotland.

Monica  :)
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Offline MonicaL

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Re: William Ruddimanand Jean Dalgarno
« Reply #2 on: Monday 19 November 12 13:32 GMT (UK) »
On William Freeman Ruddiman, who reported his death in 1860? I wonder if a mistake was made on names  :-\

A William Freeman Ruddiman shows as born to a JOHN Ruddiman and ESTHER Freeman in 1801 https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XBQ3-8KM

Other siblings seem to include:

Esther https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XBQQ-B6X
John https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XBQ7-KVC
Possibly Jean (only father's name) https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XY9C-CMC

There seem to be a lot more siblings for this William as parents John and Esther married in 1777 and William b. 1801 is showing as the last born of at least nine children.

William Ruddiman and Jean Dalgarno's children's names do seem to point to William's parents being perhaps John and Esther - their children's details here www.rootschat.com/links/0s99/

The family in 1841:

William Ruddiman 40, pawn broker
Jean Ruddiman 42
Esther Ruddiman 16
Margaret Ruddiman 16
Elisabeth Ruddiman 9
Isabella Ruddiman 2 weeks

Address: Shiprow, Aberdeenshire South

What occupation was given for William's father, from his death cert entry?

Monica
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Offline francestogneri

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Re: William Ruddimanand Jean Dalgarno
« Reply #3 on: Monday 19 November 12 14:25 GMT (UK) »
Thanks for such a quick response!  The census info for 1841 is definately my family - I have followed the twins Margaret and Esther and verified data.  William is a Wright on his marriage and a Pawnbroker in 1941.  At his death he is a Cabinet maker, which seems to be a family trade.  His father Joseph was also a Cabinet maker.

According to the Hickernell Tree and other families on Ancestry, Esther Freeman, born 1754, Aberdeen appears to have married John Ruddiman (born 7 November 1745) in 1777 and they had a son, William Freeman Ruddiman, born 28 February 1801 in Aberdeen.  He died 28 January 1860.  This confirms the information you give (however, I think the link is wrong).  I thought this was a different person.  The name of the informer of William's death, a son-in-law,  is something (Thomas I think) McGregor.

Elspet Freeman was baptised 22 June 1785.  Her parents are Alexander Freeman and Anne Aiken.  I feel certain she is the mother of the twins in the 1841 census with one being named after her.  I had not considered the possibility that her mother-in-law is ESTHER Freeman.  This is odd but could be the key I am looking for.  This is now beginning to make some sense.  Now to the Dalgarno family.


Offline francestogneri

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Re: William Ruddimanand Jean Dalgarno
« Reply #4 on: Monday 19 November 12 14:42 GMT (UK) »
Re Dalgarno - My tree is the Steele Family.  It was marked private while I was doing some intensive work on it but should now be visible.  Jean Dalgarno is my link to that family but I did not come across any siblings.  I have noted that Jean's daughter, also Jean and also sometimes called Jane, tended to name their children after family members.  I wonder if the twin Margaret Dalgarno was named after Jean's sister?

I think you have helped make a few things more clear, thanks.  Do you know anything about William Ruddiman being a Burgess of Aberdeen?  I am now beginning to think this is correct (from the Mennie tree among others).  There is also a Dalgarno who made violins and cellos and may be related.

Offline francestogneri

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Re: William Ruddimanand Jean Dalgarno
« Reply #5 on: Monday 19 November 12 14:55 GMT (UK) »
I knew there was a problem with the information.  I have just checked William's death cert again and William Ruddiman's father is definitely JOSEPH Ruddiman and not JOHN Ruddiman.  shame - it was all coming together there!

Offline MonicaL

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Re: William Ruddimanand Jean Dalgarno
« Reply #6 on: Monday 19 November 12 15:04 GMT (UK) »
Frances, regarding the parents' names given by son in law for William at his death registration in 1860, I am pretty sure that a mistake was made. Not uncommon and it did happen, but nevertheless, a pain when it did happen as you can spend time (and money) chasing ghosts... You need to satisfy yourself, but I would say that the names Joseph and Elspeth don't really feature in your line from what I have seen so far.That aside, from everything around (and there does seem to be quite a bit), if you I would be getting more comfortable that you have his parents in John and Esther, names that your William went on to give his children.

I think a number of the trees for Ruddiman look to be well researched (I specially think it is useful when they add as images their original sources as you can see how people have reached their conclusions).

The Mennie Tree seems to have a lot of info as does a few others. The Wood Tree has images connected to William Freeman Ruddiman being admitted to the Trades Burgess Register in 1823. Have you seen this document? All fits well. Father and brother, both called John, also show as wrights by occupation. Also included are images of his birth entry on the OPRs. A number of others have good sources and also have included some family photos which is always a bonus  :)

I wonder where the middle name of Baxter (as in Elizabeth Baxter name) came from? They seem to have used it across a number of generations.

For additional sites to help, not sure if you have across them. This is a useful one for Scottish naming pattern www.halmyre.abel.co.uk/Family/naming.htm  Not always used in strict order (sometimes not all) but surprising how often it was used to a great degree. Can give lots of clues about family names further back.

The use of surnames for middle names is also prevalent with Scottish names, often from the maternal female side.

Something that can sometimes trip up (apart from how fluid and irrelevant spellings were leading to many variations on spellings) is that the Scots and the Irish loved having and using first name variants. Jane/Jean/janet/Jessie are all common variants and would often be used across any registration - see www.whatsinaname.net/female-names/Jane.html

Monica  :)

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Offline francestogneri

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Re: William Ruddimanand Jean Dalgarno
« Reply #7 on: Monday 19 November 12 15:30 GMT (UK) »
Monica - thanks again.  I have seen the information you mention.  As you say it all fits nicely.  Oddly I was just wondering if I had an almost duplicate William Ruddiman.  The only place I have seen Freeman used as his middle name is on the Marriage certificate.  Everywhere else he is just 'William'.  I only added the 'Freeman' to my record when I located his death certificate and noted the maiden name of his mother.  I must admit I wondered about the name 'Joseph'.  This is the first occurrence of that name.  The only other is the 1729 baptism at Monquhitter.

I have not seen the links re the naming of families although I very quickly realised this was how to trace my family tree.  My Grandfather was Steel but my Grandmother was one Margaret Ruddiman McGregor Morgan.  Quite a handle!  With the discovery that they all lived in and around Aberdeen, this was a gift.  It makes the William Ruddiman hassle easier to bear!

Offline flst

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Re: William Ruddimanand Jean Dalgarno
« Reply #8 on: Monday 19 November 12 19:15 GMT (UK) »
I notice a few discrepancies in your posts, Frances. :)
You said William married on 17 Sep 1865, died 28 Jan 1860, & was a Pawnbroker in 1941. Do you have a correct date for his marriage (or did he marry Jane/Jean on her deathbed?)
I'll go & see if I can uncover anything on William Ruddiman.
Regards,
flst
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