1821 Census - Robert Callier b. ~1762 and Robert Callier b. ~1792

[SiCallear]

Back in 2005, I printed a copy of the Callear, Callier, calliar matches for the Parish of Wellington 1821 from the www.dawleybank.co.uk website - this now seems to be sadly obsolete.

I have a record (below) that seems to be causing me some confusion. Is anybody able to confirm the information was transcribed correctly to their website.

1821 Census
Callier Robert M 60 Collier Lawley Balls Hill
Callier MARY F 55 ""
Callier Ann F 20 ""
Callier John M 14 ""
Callier Solomon M 9 ""
Callier David M 7 ""

I can find Record of:

Robert (b.1761/62) marrying an Ann Jones (m. 1785)
   ROBERT & ANN had a son Robert (b.1792) who possibly married Mary (m. 1802)
         ROBERT & MARY possibly had a son Solomon (b.1812)

The above just does not match the my census record (which could imply Robert b 1761 is the FATHER of Solomon b. 1812). Notice the "wife's" name Mary NOT Ann In the census record), although the age does not match my proposal (above).

I think I have now tied my brain in a big knot!!

[SiCallear]

One shower later and I am now pondering on whether:

Robert (b.1761/62) marrying an Ann Jones (m. 1785)
   ROBERT & ANN had a son Robert (b.1792)
   Ann 'Jones' died   
Robert (b.1761/62) married Mary (m. 1802)
   ROBERT & MARY possibly had a son Solomon (b.1812)

[SiCallear]

Any ideas - anyone?

I think I'll struggle without establish the name(s) of the groom's father.

Meantime I'm in limbo. 

[SiCallear]

Still struggling - still need your help with this one.

Can anyone:

1. Confirm the 1821 entry that I originally posted.

2. Help me distinguish between the two Roberts and their wives(?)

Help - I'm truely stuck!!

 

[Manchester Rambler]

I found an archived version of the Dawley Bank website using the Wayback Machine site:

http://web.archive.org/web/20060212082932/http://dawleybank.co.uk/1821%20CENSUS%20-%20CALLEAR%20+%20VAR.htm

Robert CALLEAR aged 80, mine labourer, is living in Wellington in 1841 with Ann and John (their ages both rounded down to 30), and John, aged 1.  This matches your 1821 family.

Robert CALLEAR aged 45, puddler, is living in Tipton in 1841 with Sarah, aged 10.

There are some baptisms on FreeREG for children of Robert CALLEAR (puddler) and Margaret baptised in Tipton from 1817 onwards, so I think that Robert b. 1792 possibly married Margaret, not Mary.

I suspect that the first Robert married twice, and that the 3 youngest children are from his second marriage, but so far I haven't found a marriage between Robert and Mary.   Although this wouldn't give his father's name, it should at least say whether he was a widower or not.

The various spellings of the surname doesn't simplify things, does it!

Rambler

[SiCallear]

Rambler - how wonderful to receive a reply - many thanks!!

Yes - the ever 'changing' surname makes life a little bit harder! I'd love and hope to trace all branches but first first goal is to differentiate the two Roberts and their families.

"ROBERT b. 1792 possibly married Margaret, not Mary" - where have you found a reference to Robert (younger) marrying a Margaret? FreeBMD will only let me search for marriages post 1837. 'familysearch.org' returns two children (William ~b.1824 and Mary ~b.1820 - both Tipton) born to  Robert and Margaret BUT NO SARAH.

SARAH - In the 1851 census, I can not see the younger Robert. However,  I can see a Sarah shown as a servant (Aged 20 b. ~1831 Tipton) living at High Street East, Wednesbury. Maybe Robert (younger) is dead?

There is a single death record of a Robert Callier (d. 1843) but this COULD EASILY BE EITHER OF THE TWO ROBERTS - both last know alive in 1841 census.

Robert!!!!! 

[Manchester Rambler]

On FamilySearch and FreeREG, there are a some baptisms for children of Robert and Margaret Callear/Gallear, but I haven't found their marriage yet, or a birth for Sarah.   

However, on FreeREG, this Robert's occupation is given as "puddler", which matches the 1841 census - a bit thin, I know, but Robert b. c1760 was a collier, which is a bit different. 

FreeREG has a burial for Robert GALLIER, aged 69, at All Saints, Sedgley on 23 Mar 1857.  He died in the workhouse, so the age might not be 100% reliable, but it looks more like the younger one - Sedgley and Tipton are only a few miles apart.   I would guess the older Robert is the Robert CALLIER who died in Wellington reg. district in 1843, as that's where he was living in 1841.

I'll keep digging...

Rambler

[SiCallear]

Still struggling with this one - I can not find an answer that leave me feeling confident. 

[SiCallear]

Help!! Anyone up for a challenge?

Which Robert is Solmon's father? 

Sites like Ancestory and Family search show the younger Robert as the father but based on what facts? Can these sites but trusted or best to be avoided?