Author Topic: Help need as to what happened to Elizabeth WELSH  (Read 12188 times)

Offline BonnieDownUnder

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Help need as to what happened to Elizabeth WELSH
« on: Tuesday 12 February 13 05:22 GMT (UK) »
Hello,
Elizabeth Welsh nee McCallan born c1835 London arrived into Sydney on the ship 'Trafalgar' in 1853 aged 18 years and she married a widower, William Welsh, on 10 Oct 1864 in Sydney (no parents for either persons listed)

They had two daughters, Constance L. b. 1865 and Bertha Annie b. 31 Jul 1867 in Sydney.  William, just over a month prior to Bertha's birth, died on 18 Jun at the Tarban Asylum, Ryde.

I don't know what happened to Constance but Bertha, just prior to her 18th birthday, married Walter Arnold Johnston (born 09 Nov 1861 Melbourne) on 08 Mar 1886 at Gore Street, Fitzroy, Melbourne.  Their first son Arnold Walter was born in Melbourne 1887 and their subsequent 13 children all born in Sydney.

... but I don't know if Elizabeth re-married, when she died but it seems that she and her 2 ? daughters moved from Sydney to Melbourne.   Also I haven't been able to trace her on the C1841 or C1851 in England either.

Any assistance much appreciated thanks.

Offline Neil Todd

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Re: Help need as to what happened to Elizabeth Welsh
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 12 February 13 06:16 GMT (UK) »
Hi Bonnie, As this is your family connection and you have at least some information, can you tell us where this comes from. As she cannot be found on either 41/51 census how do you know you have the right Elizabeth McCallan. Also are you sure of this spelling. Should this be correct how do you know she was born in london in 1835, or is this off a ships record.
Questions I know but?

Neil
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Offline Ruskie

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Re: Help need as to what happened to Elizabeth Welsh
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 12 February 13 06:25 GMT (UK) »
Mc Callan? Have you considered that she may be Irish or Scottish? Have you had any help trying to locate her in 1841 and 1851? There are likely to be misinterpretations, misspellings and variations of that surname, so I'm wondering how extensive your searching was.  :)

Offline BonnieDownUnder

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Re: Help need as to what happened to Elizabeth Welsh
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 12 February 13 06:32 GMT (UK) »
Hey Neil, nice to hear from you and coming to my rescue once again. 

Spelling of Elizabeth's surname difficult, obviously.  On shipping record summary spelt MCLALLAN, but looking at handwriting on the actual manifest I took it to be McCallan, where age shown as 18 years, when ship arrived Sydney 1853, and that she was born London.

Marriage record, 1864, spelt MCLELLAN (I only have a transcription copy and not a copy of the original from NSW BDM) and age shown as 27 years, (and she is a 'spinster') which is two years out if born 1835?

Hi Ruskie ... no, haven't had any help as yet trying to find her on C1841/51 and see above  :)


Offline Dundee

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Re: Help need as to what happened to Elizabeth Welsh
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 12 February 13 06:44 GMT (UK) »
Elizabeth's surname on the manifest is McLALLAN, and she was born at St Ann's, Blackfriar's, London.  Parents James and Ann.  Perhaps someone can work out her mother's address.

No. 22 ?land Street, London.

Debra  :)

Offline judb

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Re: Help need as to what happened to Elizabeth Welsh
« Reply #5 on: Tuesday 12 February 13 06:51 GMT (UK) »
Bonnie - where did the McCallan spelling come from?  Do you have the girls' birth certificates and if so what name did Elizabeth use?

I would not be concerned re the 2 year age discrepancy.  Shipping lists are notoriously unreliable, as they were often copied from other information and prospective immigrants often changed age to fit the criteria set up by whoever was paying their passage.  It would be my opinion that the marriage cert age may be nearer her real age - but who knows  ???

Now, I'll ditch the half hour I've spent on McCallan and try again with the myriad variations of McClelland (I have some family of the same surname and boy, are there some variations!)

Judith
DYER - Wilts, London, Somerset, MIDLANE - Hants, Wilts, SONE - Hants, WRIGHT - London, Hants, SEAGER - Deptford, DWYER, FERGUSON - Victoria, MASON - Woodford Vic, BALLARD - South Wales, GOULDBY - Lowestoft
"Time present and time past are both perhaps present in time future..." T S Eliot

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Offline BonnieDownUnder

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Re: Help need as to what happened to Elizabeth Welsh
« Reply #6 on: Tuesday 12 February 13 08:42 GMT (UK) »
Hi Judith ... I am very sorry   :'(   that you spent so much time searching because of my mis interpretation of Elizabeth's surname, I was so sure it was McCallan ...
I must remember when posting a first message, looking for ancestors, that I give different spellings of surnames should I have doubts.

The transcription birth record (not copy of original from NSW BDM) of  Bertha Annie Welsh birth, 31 Jul 1867, 399 Pitt St., Sydney shows father William Welsh born Dublin, Ireland with mother, Elizabeth MCLAREN aged 30, born London.  I don't have her sister's birth record.

Thanks Debra for the shipping manifest you found for Elizabeth, which I hadn't seen but now found.  Obviously this certainly looks like her surname is MCLALLAN

Offline Neil Todd

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Re: Help need as to what happened to Elizabeth Welsh
« Reply #7 on: Tuesday 12 February 13 09:05 GMT (UK) »
Gees I dunno now.

I have Eliza born 1834 to parents Mary Ann and John McLallan. They are living at  Artillery Lane
Saint Botolph District East London, Middlesex. That is 1851 census. Her mother was aged 50 and her father 54.

Neil
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Offline ~MERLIN~

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Re: Help need as to what happened to Elizabeth Welsh
« Reply #8 on: Tuesday 12 February 13 09:54 GMT (UK) »