Author Topic: Carnie, Brand & Noble - Newhaven and Leith  (Read 3630 times)

Offline SpudJW

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Carnie, Brand & Noble - Newhaven and Leith
« on: Tuesday 09 July 13 09:27 BST (UK) »
I'd be interested to know if anyone else is looking into the Carnie, Brand and Noble families in Newhaven and Leith. I'm following back from my grandmother, Emily Dores Carnie Brand, born 1903 in South Leith to James Marr Brand and Emily Dores Carnie. I'm especially curious to discover where the Dores element in the name comes from, since at the moment it hasn't come up anywhere in the tree.

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Offline tidybooks

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Re: Carnie, Brand & Noble - Newhaven and Leith
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 09 July 13 11:23 BST (UK) »
Hi SpudJW,

With a name like Carnie in Newhaven area, would expect some connection to fishing.

I have found a Mary Dores Carnie born to parents Liston Carnie and Isabella Dores on LDS site on 30 Mar 1860 at Leith.

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FQCN-FFK

There is an Emily Doves(sic) Carnie born on 10 Dec 1865 to parents John Carnie and Christina Noble.

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FQCN-RQT

Probably connected to your tree, would think Liston and John would be siblings, not proved as yet.

Tom
Scotland - Buchanan, Thomson, Pat(t)erson, Stewart, Ritchie, Tracey
Ireland - Tracey, Conroy, Pat(t)erson.

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Offline SpudJW

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Re: Carnie, Brand & Noble - Newhaven and Leith
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 09 July 13 13:29 BST (UK) »
Yes, Tom, fishermen all. Emily Dores Carnie - we can presume the Doves is a mistranscription - was my gran's mother.

Emily's father John Carnie had a son Liston, but he would only have been about 10 in 1860. John's father was also Liston, however, and in the 1841 census his wife Janet Mair or Muir is no longer in residence: I wonder if he married again, to Isabella Dores?

If Isabella's Liston were John's brother, would that be reason enough to include her surname in their daughter's name?

Offline torilar

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Re: Carnie, Brand & Noble - Newhaven and Leith
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 23 July 13 00:33 BST (UK) »
Hi,
I don't know how far into your research you are but Newhaven was a very insular village and most people who lived there were related in some way or another so working out who's who is mind numbing.  I have been working on the Newhaven branch of my tree for quite some time now and it gets more confusing every time I look at it.

I have your Emily Dores Carnie in my tree... I also have Isabella Dores (Carnie).......I haven't as yet made any connection between them but I will keep looking... I have James Brand's middle name as Moir (his mother's maiden name).  Did you know that Emily's sister Helen married James' brother Robert ....

If you think I may be able to help you in any way please let me know and I will do my best.
Regards
Aileen
Hackland.....Orkney/ Leith/ Worldwide
Watt.....Aberdeenshire
Mc/Mac Donnell.....Inverness-shire
Crawford.......Douglas Lanarkshire/Newhaven Edinburgh
Keith......Aberdeenshire/Kincardineshire/Perthshire/
Clingan.....Midlothian/

Offline torilar

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Re: Carnie, Brand & Noble - Newhaven and Leith
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 23 July 13 00:50 BST (UK) »
should also have mentioned I do have another couple of Dores in my tree and will attempt to look for connections.
Isabella Dores did marry a Liston Carnie....but not the "right" one.
Hackland.....Orkney/ Leith/ Worldwide
Watt.....Aberdeenshire
Mc/Mac Donnell.....Inverness-shire
Crawford.......Douglas Lanarkshire/Newhaven Edinburgh
Keith......Aberdeenshire/Kincardineshire/Perthshire/
Clingan.....Midlothian/

Offline torilar

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Re: Carnie, Brand & Noble - Newhaven and Leith
« Reply #5 on: Tuesday 23 July 13 06:13 BST (UK) »
http://www.johnlyle3.webspace.virginmedia.com/oldnewhaven/

You may find this of some interest if you haven't already seen it
Hackland.....Orkney/ Leith/ Worldwide
Watt.....Aberdeenshire
Mc/Mac Donnell.....Inverness-shire
Crawford.......Douglas Lanarkshire/Newhaven Edinburgh
Keith......Aberdeenshire/Kincardineshire/Perthshire/
Clingan.....Midlothian/

Offline torilar

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Re: Carnie, Brand & Noble - Newhaven and Leith
« Reply #6 on: Tuesday 23 July 13 06:25 BST (UK) »
Sorry this hasn't worked too well

Kinship of Emily Dores Carnie

Name   Relationship with Emily Carnie
   
Brand, Euphemia   Sister-in-law      
Brand, James Moir   Husband      
Brand, Mary   Daughter   
Brand, Robert   Brother-in-law      
   Brother-in-law      
Brand, Robert Marr   Nephew   
   Nephew of the husband      
Brand, William   Father-in-law      
Brand, William   Brother-in-law      
Carnie, Christina   Niece   
Carnie, Emily Dores   Self      
Carnie, Frances Ann   1st cousin   
Carnie, Helen   Niece   
Carnie, Helen Durham   Sister   
Carnie, Hugh Muir   Uncle   
Carnie, James   Uncle   
Carnie, Janet   Sister   
Carnie, John   Father   
Carnie, John   Brother   
Carnie, John   Nephew   
Carnie, Liston   Grandfather   
Carnie, Margaret Henderson   Aunt   
Carnie, Mary   Aunt   
Carnie, Mary   Niece   
Carnie, May Brown Innes   1st cousin   
Carnie, Robert   Uncle   
Carnie, Thomas Muir   Uncle   
Carnie, Thomas Muir   Brother   
Carnie, Thomas Muir   Nephew   
Carnie, Walter   Nephew   
Davidson, Ann   1st cousin once removed   
Davidson, Catherine   1st cousin once removed   
Davidson, Frances   1st cousin once removed   
Davidson, Helen   1st cousin once removed   
Davidson, Janet   1st cousin once removed   
Davidson, John   1st cousin once removed   
Davidson, Margaret   1st cousin once removed   
Davidson, May         1st cousin once removed   
Davidson, Robert   Husband of the 1st cousin      
Davidson, Robina   1st cousin once removed   
Davidson, Thomas   1st cousin once removed   
Davidson, William   1st cousin once removed   
Drybrough, David   1st cousin once removed   
Drybrough, John   Husband of the 1st cousin      
Durham, Helen   Grandmother   
Henderson, Christina   Wife of the nephew      
Moir, Mary   Mother-in-law      
Muir, Janet   Grandmother   
Noble, Alexander   Grandfather   
Noble, Christina   Mother   
Robertson, Elizabeth Brown   Sister-in-law      
Smith, Thomas   Brother-in-law      
Treverton, Charity Strout   Wife of the uncle      
Young, Catharine Riddell   1st cousin   
Young, David   1st cousin   
Young, James   Husband of the aunt      
Young, James   1st cousin   
Young, Janet Mair   1st cousin   
Young, Liston   1st cousin   
Young, Mary   1st cousin   
Hackland.....Orkney/ Leith/ Worldwide
Watt.....Aberdeenshire
Mc/Mac Donnell.....Inverness-shire
Crawford.......Douglas Lanarkshire/Newhaven Edinburgh
Keith......Aberdeenshire/Kincardineshire/Perthshire/
Clingan.....Midlothian/

Offline torilar

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Re: Carnie, Brand & Noble - Newhaven and Leith
« Reply #7 on: Tuesday 23 July 13 06:57 BST (UK) »
I may be getting somewhere....although still trying to connect

I have an Amelia Dores married to a James Noble.....Amelia was known as Emily
Hackland.....Orkney/ Leith/ Worldwide
Watt.....Aberdeenshire
Mc/Mac Donnell.....Inverness-shire
Crawford.......Douglas Lanarkshire/Newhaven Edinburgh
Keith......Aberdeenshire/Kincardineshire/Perthshire/
Clingan.....Midlothian/

Offline SpudJW

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Re: Carnie, Brand & Noble - Newhaven and Leith
« Reply #8 on: Tuesday 23 July 13 09:44 BST (UK) »
Thanks for all this, Aileen! I've got some more bits & bobs too, I'll post them as soon as I can. It is a terrible labyrinth of names around there: I remember when I was doing my first days of research at the Records Office I just gave up on this line in despair at ever sorting them all out!

Does this make sense to you?:

Amelia, also Emily, seems to have been called Bemellie Bell at her birth, her parents being Andrew Dors and Isabelle Liston - Isabelle, I think, remarried to a William Patterson in 1833. Before marrying James Noble, looking at the 1851 census, it seem Amelia might have had an illegitimate son to a Liston Carnie, since a boy of the same name is in residence, as "Grandson".