Annie Crundwell - birth record not on bdm

[DonL]

Thanks for all that information, although it has not helped find Annie's birth though.
I had raised the matter with BDM after they had agreed to amend the records for Caroline Emma Crundwell whose birth was registered by her illiterate mother Susannah Crundwell (nee Miskelly) where the birth was recorded as Cromwell and her mother's maiden name as Kelly. The registrar had obviously thought Susannah had said Miss Kelly.

BDM have not managed to trace the birth and hinted that it may not have been registered and suggested that I visit the library and search Wellington births for the reported year of Annie's birth. With a beloved wife seriously and incurably ill. I do not have the spare time to be plowing through micrograph records.
Thanks for the help and suggestions

DonL

[OAKLEIGH]

Just to get it straight - here it is copied from the NZ Government site:

"Births and deaths have been officially recorded since 1848.
•   Marriages have been recorded since 1854.
•   In 1911, it was required that Māori marriages be recorded.
•   In 1913, it was required that Māori birth and deaths be recorded.
•   Separate Māori and General registration systems were kept until 1961 although some Māori events are registered in the general system.
•   As registration could not be enforced many Māori births and deaths were not registered.
•   Births Deaths and Marriages where originally part of the Colonial Secretary's office.
•   Registers were also established to record overseas marriages and war deaths covering all wars since WWI.

Later registrations provide more information to researchers than earlier ones, however there is still a lot of useful information to be gathered from the early records."

It was not at all uncommon for only a few children in a family to have their births registered - even into the 1900's.  That accounts for the very late registrations when overseas travellers were required to have a passport, and when a birth certificate was required for other reasons.

Somewhat daunting.  Church and school records seem to be about the only alternative.

OAKLEIGH

[majm]

Hi there DonL and others following this thread,

Like many regulars at RChat, I have been a contributor to a number of DonLs threads, and also seen his hand helping others.  Don, you and your beloved wife are in my thoughts.   

I am sure that Don does not need to read the following as it deals with BDM registries PRIOR to civil registration being introduced on both sides of the Tasman Sea, so it is decades earlier than his elusive Annie’s birth.   Perhaps a Moderator may consider splitting off what seems to be a slight  side track into a separate thread? If so, may I please request that the following move along with that.

I have long understood that many of the early NZ Church records were recorded in registers held in New South Wales.  Civil Registrations in NSW commenced March 1856.   Quite a lot of the Early Church Records are indexed at NSW BDM online index and if for baptisms or burials then there is NO listing of the “District”.  However, the Early Church Records indexed for weddings do include codes entered under the heading “District”.   Those codes are available at the following NSW BDM link.
http://www.bdm.nsw.gov.au/bdm_fh/bdm_crh.html#
You will notice for example that XG represents the Wesleyan register for New Zealand.

If you have an earlier version of the NSW BDM index (my discs have not worked for many a year, sorry), you can determine the “NSW BDM district” for baptisms and for burials, and not just for marriages, as those earlier versions included many more fields than the current online index does. .    There are some very good RChatters, (nearly as good at the regulars on the NZ Board) on the Aussie Board, and they can help with that type of look up.

I suspect that NSW BDM Registrar General may have sent copies of their holdings to NZ BDM around the same time as they sent copies to Qld BDM and to Vic BDM.  Qld BDM has records indexed as early as 1820s.  Vic BDM has records indexed as early as 1830s.  Of course all the records that are earlier than civil registration are based on the Early Church Records.

The NSW indexes were first prepared by teams of volunteers in the 1930s, so they were indexing pages that were already fragile, with bleed throughs, thumbed corners, etc.   They were also reading long hand, that had faded, been scribbled over, etc.   So the index has flaws. 

Further flaws developed when NSW BDM was first transferring to Computer.  The EDP system of cards saw damaged cards, apparently duplicated entries disgarded, lost cards etc.

So, like any index, NSW BDM’s online index is not as perfect as it could be, but it may have some 19th Century NZ BDM events in the NSW registers.

http://www.bdm.nsw.gov.au/bdm_fh.html

You do not need to fill in all the boxes, but you do need to fill in at least a name (can be either surname or given name)  The “ ? “ can be used as though a wild card, and it represents ONE character.  So ?? is two characters etc.

You can sort by clicking on a particular heading.

If the registration has “V” in part of the reference no. then it is an EARLY CHURCH RECORD, and is not a civil registration.  “V” represents “Volume” and it does NOT represent “Vital Records”. 

If you know someone who is coming to Sydney, and has spare moments, and wants to look up the “V” record rather than order an official transcription (or a real deal cert), then NSW State Library (Macquarie Street, Sydney 2000) has images of each record in their holdings, and there is usually quite a number of people accessing those records on a daily basis.

Cheers,  JM (NSW centric, with many NZ ancestors in my tree)

[DonL]

Annie Crundwell was admitted to St Mary's - Girls on 8 January 1885 aged 11 years & 6 months.  It was an Industrial School. Other sisters attended that school too. In 1900 she married James Morris Whitmore Chresteren.  In the early days it was not required that births be registered.

The Annie Crundwell (Susannah Miskelly)  who married James Morris Whitmore Chrestensen was the mother of the Annie Crundwell whom I looking for her birth information, she died age 14.

Annie was the first child of Susannah Crundwell (an illiterate)

DonL