Author Topic: Tracing Thomas Halberts Ancestry  (Read 20410 times)

Offline Revolution

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Re: Tracing Thomas Halberts Ancestry
« Reply #9 on: Monday 28 October 13 09:52 GMT (UK) »
Hi DavidFt

Thank you it doesnt look like we looked at those as sources for information.

I wonder why this is no record of any other Halberts for the area? Im assuming it was the poor who didnt leave wills?
McGaveston - Dublin-Ireland, France, New Zealand
White - Shalden, Alton, Chawton-Hampshire
O'Donnell - New Zealand, Co Down-Northern Ireland, USA
Franklin/Fraenkel - New Zealand, Prussia
Day - Echuca, Tongala, London, Fairford-Gloucestershire
Clark/McGraw - New Zealand, Ireland, England
McMahon -Ipswich-QLD, Kiladysart-Co Clare
Smith - Ipswich, Pine Mountain, Redbank-QLD, Co Westmeath, Co Cavan-Ireland
McGuire - Redbank - QLD, Co Westmeath-Ireland
Culhane - Queensland, Ardlaghan - Co Limerick

Offline Revolution

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Re: Tracing Thomas Halberts Ancestry
« Reply #10 on: Monday 28 October 13 09:53 GMT (UK) »
"Have you tried "Durham Records Online". The Gateshead filter starts off with Alice Potts Halbert. Searching the whole county brings up pages of them. I personally had never come across the name before.

Thanks Barryd

Ive never seen it but perhaps my genealogist had. I really wish we knew more about Thomas Halbert and his family.
McGaveston - Dublin-Ireland, France, New Zealand
White - Shalden, Alton, Chawton-Hampshire
O'Donnell - New Zealand, Co Down-Northern Ireland, USA
Franklin/Fraenkel - New Zealand, Prussia
Day - Echuca, Tongala, London, Fairford-Gloucestershire
Clark/McGraw - New Zealand, Ireland, England
McMahon -Ipswich-QLD, Kiladysart-Co Clare
Smith - Ipswich, Pine Mountain, Redbank-QLD, Co Westmeath, Co Cavan-Ireland
McGuire - Redbank - QLD, Co Westmeath-Ireland
Culhane - Queensland, Ardlaghan - Co Limerick

Offline davidft

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Re: Tracing Thomas Halberts Ancestry
« Reply #11 on: Monday 28 October 13 21:07 GMT (UK) »
Hi DavidFt

Thank you it doesnt look like we looked at those as sources for information.

I wonder why this is no record of any other Halberts for the area? Im assuming it was the poor who didnt leave wills?

In reality there would have been more wills made than survive. several years back there was an article in the Northumberland and Durham family history journal about this. Apparently the person in charge of looking after wills in Durham in the early 19th century use to use old wills to light his cigars !!!!! and no doubt he was not the only one.
James Stott c1775-1850. James was born in Yorkshire but where? He was a stonemason and married Elizabeth Archer (nee Nicholson) in 1794 at Ripon. They lived thereafter in Masham. If anyone has any suggestions or leads as to his birthplace I would be interested to know. I have searched for it for years without success. Thank you.

Offline Revolution

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Re: Tracing Thomas Halberts Ancestry
« Reply #12 on: Friday 01 November 13 09:03 GMT (UK) »
Hi Davidft

Ill look into ordering the two wills and see if there are any links there. If not Ill continue the search...
McGaveston - Dublin-Ireland, France, New Zealand
White - Shalden, Alton, Chawton-Hampshire
O'Donnell - New Zealand, Co Down-Northern Ireland, USA
Franklin/Fraenkel - New Zealand, Prussia
Day - Echuca, Tongala, London, Fairford-Gloucestershire
Clark/McGraw - New Zealand, Ireland, England
McMahon -Ipswich-QLD, Kiladysart-Co Clare
Smith - Ipswich, Pine Mountain, Redbank-QLD, Co Westmeath, Co Cavan-Ireland
McGuire - Redbank - QLD, Co Westmeath-Ireland
Culhane - Queensland, Ardlaghan - Co Limerick


Offline Revolution

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Re: Tracing Thomas Halberts Ancestry
« Reply #13 on: Tuesday 05 November 13 03:06 GMT (UK) »
Hi

Is there any other way I can find a birth for a Thomas Halbert for 8 July 1806 ?

Is it unusual not  to have a place of birth registered anywhere?

Thanks!
McGaveston - Dublin-Ireland, France, New Zealand
White - Shalden, Alton, Chawton-Hampshire
O'Donnell - New Zealand, Co Down-Northern Ireland, USA
Franklin/Fraenkel - New Zealand, Prussia
Day - Echuca, Tongala, London, Fairford-Gloucestershire
Clark/McGraw - New Zealand, Ireland, England
McMahon -Ipswich-QLD, Kiladysart-Co Clare
Smith - Ipswich, Pine Mountain, Redbank-QLD, Co Westmeath, Co Cavan-Ireland
McGuire - Redbank - QLD, Co Westmeath-Ireland
Culhane - Queensland, Ardlaghan - Co Limerick

Offline SelDen

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Re: Tracing Thomas Halberts Ancestry
« Reply #14 on: Wednesday 08 October 14 08:46 BST (UK) »
Hi

There seem to be posts re Thomas Halbert on the Ayrshire, Northumberland & Durham boards over the years, as well as quite a few other fora from a range of people - here is a link to the most recent, also by Revolution, last month

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=418982.9

Firstly, here is some info about a James Halbert who died in Kingower, Victoria, Australia who seems to have a connection to the Mary Halbert who married David Carrot.

James Halbert

Merchant navy records - born Newcastle, NBL 15 Sep 1827, Seaman, has served 7 months in Royal Navy & 14 Months in Foreign Service (American), lives in Gateshead, ticket issued 6 Jan 1847

At Gateshead on 11 June 1849 Mr James Halbert, Mariner to Miss Isabella Miller
Durham County Advertiser, 22 June 1849

You could order the marriage certificate using the reference obtained from www.freebmd.org.uk and ordering from the General Register Office here http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/

You could also order a film of the marriage registers for St Mary's, Gateshead. See www.familysearch.org for the on-line film catalogue and the location of LDS family history centres where you can view the film.

1851 Census HO107/2402 folio 725 Gateshead St Mary’s
Listers H? Yard
James Halbert Hd Mar 24 born Newcastle upon Tyne
Isabella wife 20 NBL Bedlington?
Magt? dau 1 DUR Gateshead

6 Dec 1907 Kingower, Shire of Karong, County of Gladstone, James Halbert, Miner. aged 80 years, Cause of death, Apoplexy, Second attack, 16 hours, parents names - “Not known”, Informant Ellen Halbert, Daughter in Law, Kingower, buried 8 Dec 1907 Kingower Cemetery, born Newcastle, 54 years in Australian colonies - Victoria, age at marriage not known, place of marriage not known, name of spouse - Isabella Millar, Children:
John Potts 56 years
James Lindsay 53 years
Jonathan Millar deceased
Thomas 50
Michael 48
Isabella 46
Joseph 44
Barbara deceased
Margaret Clare? 43
Jane 42
David 40
Robert 38
Joshua deceased

David Carrot Halbert died in Kingower, Victoria aged 45 in 1910, parents James Halbert & Isabella Miller according to various Ancestry trees.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingower,_Victoria




Offline Revolution

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Re: Tracing Thomas Halberts Ancestry
« Reply #15 on: Wednesday 08 October 14 09:13 BST (UK) »
Thanks SelDen, thats some great info!

Ive started this blog to try to encourage more people to come forward.

http://cerberuscoins.wordpress.com/2014/09/14/descendants-of-thomas-halbert-1806-1865/

Id also like to find some direct male descendants of Thomas and James who would be willing to take a DNA test (mouth swab) which would then either confirm the relationship or refute it.
McGaveston - Dublin-Ireland, France, New Zealand
White - Shalden, Alton, Chawton-Hampshire
O'Donnell - New Zealand, Co Down-Northern Ireland, USA
Franklin/Fraenkel - New Zealand, Prussia
Day - Echuca, Tongala, London, Fairford-Gloucestershire
Clark/McGraw - New Zealand, Ireland, England
McMahon -Ipswich-QLD, Kiladysart-Co Clare
Smith - Ipswich, Pine Mountain, Redbank-QLD, Co Westmeath, Co Cavan-Ireland
McGuire - Redbank - QLD, Co Westmeath-Ireland
Culhane - Queensland, Ardlaghan - Co Limerick

Offline SelDen

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Re: Tracing Thomas Halberts Ancestry
« Reply #16 on: Wednesday 08 October 14 09:14 BST (UK) »
A bit of information about the John Halbert who is the possible parent of James Halbert & Mary Carrott. You probably already have much of this, but thought I would set it out for others who may have pieces to contribute to the puzzle.

John Halbert of this parish & Dorothy Gibson of this parish married by banns 13 January 1814, witnesses James Reed (a frequent witness) & William Appleby. Bride made her mark.
Marriages, St Mary’s Gateshead, image no 66 in on-line Gateshead BTs 1812-1823


Dorothy Halbert buried 1819 aged 27 years (so born abt 1792)
Burials, Gateshead

John Halbert of this parish & Barbara Charlton of this parish were married by Banns 16 January 1820, both signed, witnesses George Halbert & Thomas Cummin (a frequent witness)
Marriages, Gateshead Bishop’s Transcripts image no 412 1812-1823

1841 Census HO107/296/14 folio 39 p18
Gateshead, Bottle Bank
[this is a couple of houses away from the David & Mary Carrit household]
John Halbert 41 Cork Cutter No[t born in county]
Barbara 25 Y
Isabella 16 Y
Ann 14 Y
Sarah 8 Y
Elizabeth 6 Y
Michael 3 Y
Barbara 1 Y

28 July 1844 Isaac Anderson of full age, Bachelor, Shoemaker, Oakwellgate, son of Robert Anderson, Shoemaker, & Ann Halbert, Spinster, Minor [i.e. aged under 21 years], Bottlebank, daughter of John Halbert, Cork Cutter, both bride & groom made their marks, married by Banns, witnesses John Halbert & Barbara Halbert
Marriages, St Mary’s, Gateshead

1851 Census Ho107/2402 Gateshead St Mary’s
Back? Lane
John Halbert Hd Mar 56 Cork Cutter Newcastle
Barbara do wife 49 DUR Gateshead
Sarah do dau 18 at home born do
Elizabeth do dau 16 dressmaker do
Michael do son Smith helper do
Thomas do son 8 Scholar do
Barbara do nurse child 4 mo do

You may well have the baptisms for these children from your researcher. If not you can locate them in the indexed records on www.familysearch.org and use these index entries to help you find them on the on-line but unindexed Bishops' Transcripts also on www.familysearch.org

For example - the baptism of James Charlton Halbert s/o John & Barbara Halbert baptised 5 Jan 1828, St John, Newcastle upon Tyne.

There are some difficulties with seeing this particular John Halbert as the father of your Thomas Halbert (assuming that the parent details on the Gateshead baptism that you have were mixed up somehow):
1) www.familysearch.org for the Thomas Halbert in 1814 in Gateshead gives a birth date of 8 July 1806, too early for John to be a likely parent and some years prior to his first marriage; and
2)John & Barbara Halbert have an 8 year old son Thomas in the 1851 census. Of course, they could have thought the first one had died, if they had not heard from him in a very long time.

I have some thoughts about other options which will have to wait until I have more time, but generally I think you are on the right track if you continue to pull together all the info you can on the Tyneside Halberts and draw up a bit of a tree to sort out the John Potts, to see if and how Tame Poto fits into this large family. These are possibly the descendants of William Halbert & Alice/Alison Potts who married in Kelso, Roxburgh 21 August 1763.

The actual parish registers for C of E entries in the period 1798-1812 are more detailed in Durham & NBL than before or after, so these are worth tracking down on film or through the on-line BTs (watch out for gaps, sometimes days or years). I appreciate many of the Halberts were baptised as non-conformists, particularly the earlier ones.

Offline SelDen

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Re: Tracing Thomas Halberts Ancestry
« Reply #17 on: Wednesday 08 October 14 09:19 BST (UK) »
Yes, a DNA test would confirm common male descent but it would be good to sort out where in the family Thomas fits in  :D

The George Halbert from Aberdeen is also intriguing.