"of this parish" - rock solid, or moveable feast?

[bugbear]

Probably, as has been suggested, because, for whatever reason, they wanted to marry in a parish where they weren't known 

Jan

Worst kept secret ever :-) They came back to Shoreditch, lived together, and started producing kids.

Thomas was born at Webb (or Web's) square, and Thomas and Charlotte were living at Webb square 22 years later when their first child was born...

 BugBear

[jorose]

I don't know that they were necessarily both suitcase jobs.  If you have a baptism in the 1780s, that doesn't mean that Charlotte's family hadn't moved elsewhere by the time of the marriage, or that she hadn't moved by herself from another location (doing live-in domestic work, for example), or that there wasn't some family connection to that area.

For either of the possible Charlottes, have you looked at siblings and where they marry (if they can be found). Or for Saint John of Jerusalem, Hackney, are there other Howard marriages there? Other Coles?  You might find a group of siblings all born in parish A and married at Hackney.

[iluleah]

  yes but you forget you have the benefit of travel, internet access and parish records which you can view, back then many never left the street they were born in  while many others moved to the other side of the world.

I have so many who 'dissappeared off the radar' which when there was no internet to cut 'research the clues' time down it took years of physically looking in each PR to find 'possibles' and they may have only gone 2 miles away to marry..... a search now which takes 10 seconds, where as one I am thinking of took me nearly 15 years of record office research to find after looking in 3 different counties at all churches PRs

[bugbear]

I don't know that they were necessarily both suitcase jobs.  If you have a baptism in the 1780s, that doesn't mean that Charlotte's family hadn't moved elsewhere by the time of the marriage, or that she hadn't moved by herself from another location (doing live-in domestic work, for example), or that there wasn't some family connection to that area.

For either of the possible Charlottes, have you looked at siblings and where they marry (if they can be found). Or for Saint John of Jerusalem, Hackney, are there other Howard marriages there? Other Coles?  You might find a group of siblings all born in parish A and married at Hackney.

That's a good thought; further sibling baptisms would give me "likely" locations for the family (and hence Charlotte), as would sibling marriages.

I shall do as you suggest.

 BugBear

[iluleah]

I agree with jorose if this was my ancestry I would be looking sideways, siblings, who they married and where, the PR baptisms and who was baptised where as the siblings all go back to he same parents ( normally) and  that also gives you a wider picture about the family and certainly for me it makes me more objective in my research.
Which is why rootschat is so great the people who help are objective and look at the bigger picture, they ask the questions that you as the researcher ignore and point out the 'flaws in our thinking' as these people 'belong' to us so like any 'family' we sometimes don't 'see the wood for the trees'

[janan]

Probably, as has been suggested, because, for whatever reason, they wanted to marry in a parish where they weren't known 

Jan

Worst kept secret ever :-) They came back to Shoreditch, lived together, and started producing kids.

Thomas was born at Webb (or Web's) square, and Thomas and Charlotte were living at Webb square 22 years later when their first child was born...

 BugBear

Ah but they would have been married by then so it would no longer matter  My great great grandparents moved back to their parish, living within a stone's throw of both sets of parents.

Of course, if you haven't already done so, it would be a good idea to check that there were no children born in Hackney to your likely couple.

Jan

[behindthefrogs]

Our ancestors lived in what is now the London Borough of Hillingdon.  Many of them were married in London usually in the Paddington area.  The addresses on their marriage certificates showed them both living at the same Paddington address.  As they were known to be employed in the Hillingdon area these were clearly "suitcase" addresses.  Suitcase because residence was established by leaving a suitcase at the address while not actually living there.

[bugbear]

..the PR baptisms...

Pardon my ignorance - what's a "PR baptism"?

 BugBear

[KGarrad]

..the PR baptisms...

Pardon my ignorance - what's a "PR baptism"?

 BugBear

Parish Register Baptisms!