William Stewart or Scott born in Crieff

[HeatherConnie]

I have a puzzle with my great-great grandfather William Scott who was born in Crieff. I have found some information on Scotland's People but am struggling now and hope someone might be able to help.
His marriage registration from 1876 gives his parents as David Scott, Brewer and Mary Scott, MS Stewart, however his death registration records his name as formerly Stewart, his mother as  Mary Stewart and his father is not mentioned. As William was 24 when he married, I searched for  a William birth in Crieff around 1851 or 52 and found a possible match. William Roy and Elizabeth Stewart had a son William in 1851. There is a marriage proclamation for William and Elizabeth from 1853 so, assuming this is the same couple, William would have had his mother's surname Stewart. I've tried birth searches to see if Elizabeth and Mary are the same person, and census searches to try and link Elizabeth or Mary Stewart with David Scott and William Stewart, Scott or possibly even Roy. Unfortunately these are all common names and I don't know how long William would have been in Crieff after he was born. In 1876 he was living in Dundee and working as a carter.

[andycand]

Hi

The 1861 census has the following

Auchterarder Road, Dunning

Mary Stewart 34 born Madderty  Perthshire, field labourer
William Scott 8 son born Crieff, Perthshire
John Cameron 5 son born Trinity Gask, Perthshire

A check of Familysearch suggests that John Cameron birth was registered Trinity Gask as John Stewart, born 4th October 1855 mother Mary Stewart, no father mentioned. This would suggest John was illegitimate.

As William was born before Statutory Registration commenced you are looking for a christening, the OPRs relate to the Church of Scotland, other denominations such as the Free Church of Scotland are for the most part not online.

Andy

[JMStrachan]

It looks as if William was illegitimate and given his father’s surname of Scott, which was common practice in Scotland. Can’t see a baptism on FamilySearch or ScotlandsPeople, so perhaps he either wasn’t baptised or his baptism record hasn’t survived.

The information on the marriage and death certificate is whatever the registrar was told, so isn’t always correct. It depends on what the person getting married, or the informant for a death, knew or was willing to say.

I think this could be William and his mother in 1861. If so, Mary had a second illegitimate son.
1861 Census:
Auchterarder Road, Dunning
Mary Stewart head age 34, field labourer, born Madderty, Perth
William Scott son age 8, scholar, born Crieff, Perth
John Cameron son age 5, scholar, born Trinity Gask, Perth

On FamilySearch there is a baptism for John Stewart in 1855 at Trinity Gask, mother Mary Stewart, no father named. Could be worth look this up on ScotlandsPeople as it was the first year of civil registration, and birth certificates for that year contain a lot of detail.

This looks like Mary in 1851, a servant with a Scott family:182
1851 census:
Montague Mill Farm, Kilspindie, Perthshire
Thomas Scott head age 50, farmer of 100 acres, born Auchtergarven
Jean Scott wife age 49, born Methven
Mary Stewart servant age 24, born Madderty

Perhaps David Scott was related to Thomas Scott?

1841 census:
There’s a Mary Scott age 15 and a Helen Scott age 15 (therefore their ages were 15 to 19) at Auchtergaven in the household of Robert Scott at Caerny Hill, Auchtergaven, plus Robert’s wife and children. Worth looking this up on ScotlandsPeople to see the actual image. Mary and Helen could have been servants or relatives.

FamilySearch has a baptism for Mary Stewart in 1826 at Madderty, parents Alex Stewart and Ann Nish.

[HeatherConnie]

Thank you so much Andy and JM. I've got a lot to check out now. I hope I can be as helpful to someone in time.

[NScott]

I am a descendant of the Scots of Kilspindie with reference to the Mill of Montague.
My family tree states that I am descended from James Scot b1767 d1818.  I can confirm that there are no Scots  or Scotts by the name David or Thomas in my line of the family, however there were two other Scotts (earlier references refer to the name as Scot) which may yield some answers, also from the parish of Kilspindie of the Mill (Miln) of Montague.

James Scot (my descendent was the illegitimate son of John Scot b. 19-8-1733 and Elspet Duncan a maidservant, John Scott was married to Ann Walker 10-8-1763). 
John Scot also had a legitimate son by the same name, John Scot b 1-5-1768 who may have had children but the researchers of my family tree did not investigate this line of the family. 
John Scott b.19-8-1733 also had a brother named George Scott (b.15-4-1736) and his father's name was Daniel Scott (b. around 1700).

You may find the parish records yield more information.  Two spellings of the name, Scot and Scott were used. 

The Presbyterian Church at the time considered having an illegitimate child a huge scandal.  As such, John Scot of shows up in the Parish of Kilspindie records as being admonished, to quote from a book written about my family history, "having agreed to pay the sum of 15 pounds to the poor in the parish before he was allowed to receive a rebuke in Lennox Seat (the penance seat), and so be absolved form the scandal of the fornication with Elspet Duncan, his own servant, to which the session consented and he was rebuked accordingly in his own seat upon the Sabbath of the sixteenth of August by the minister for his sin of fornication with Elspet Duncan" - From Perthshire to Prosperity - The story of a Scott Family that Emigrated, Multiplied and Prospered.  by William David Scott.2009, Tamworth, NSW ISBN 978-0-646-49813-3

You may find that other records with the parish churches in the area reveal another scandal that led to admonishing of your ancestors? :-)
You could also check Kinnaird, Kilspindie and Errol OPR (Old Parochial Records) for more info.
Good luck with the search.

[HeatherConnie]

Thank you for that information. I have found a David Scott working as a miller's apprentice in the mill at Montague in the 1851 census. It seems likely that this is my ancestor, but of course I would need to find more to be certain.
So far I've added to my family history the following - "In 1851 Mary Stewart, aged 24 and born in Madderty, was working as a servant in the home of another Scott couple at Montague Mill Farm, Kilspindie, east of Perth. They were Thomas Scott aged 50, a farmer of 100 acres born in Auchtergaven, and his wife Jean Scott aged 49 born in Methven. David Scott aged 18 was the corn miller's apprentice at Montague Mill. It seems likely that these two were our Mary and David. It also seems reasonable that a corn miller would have the experience needed to be employed as a brewer."