Author Topic: Reverend Edward Poole and his son James Poole in Caynham and Ludlow  (Read 4453 times)

Offline larzus

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Reverend Edward Poole and his son James Poole in Caynham and Ludlow
« on: Wednesday 24 September 14 04:43 BST (UK) »
I have been on the trail of this family for a while now and cannot get any further back with confidence.

The Reverend Edward Poole died in 1776 in Caynham and left a will.  In his will he bequeathed property to his adult children.  I already knew about the children from other sources so the will was simply confirmation.

His wife was apparently named Mary and she came with a thousand pound dowry - pretty good for the 1740s.  I have no idea at all of her maiden name and would love to find it.  Mary died in 1772 in Caynham.

Ch:

Mary b 1741 m (1) Benjamin Biddulph (2) Ralph Cope Hopton
Elizabeth b 1742 lived to elderly age as a spinster
Frances b 1744 m Thomas Cooke
Edward b 1746 m Catherine
James bc 1745 m Ann prob Cooper
Ann bc 1748 m Rev John Taylor

James is my husband's line. 

James was in the military and is generally referred to as 'Major James Poole' in newspaper announcements.  He became the Paymaster-General to the troops in Ireland at a time of which there seem to be no surviving records. 

James and Ann had the following children:

Mary Ann 1773 in Ludlow did not marry
Frances 1776 in Ludlow, m (1) Lambert Middleton (2) Marcus Annesley
Elizabeth 1779 in Ludlow no further knowledge
Jane 1781 in Ludlow did not marry
James 1786 m Margaret Fielden and died of injuries sustained in Battle of Waterloo
Caroline 1788 in Mordiford Herefordshire (my husband's ancestress)


I would like to learn more of the lines of Edward and James' wives.  I believe James married Anne Cooper in Market Drayton and that she was of good family but I have no good confirmation of this.  Edward's wife was clearly from a wealthy family.

The Reverend Edward Poole is commonly considered to be the son of James Poole and Ann Jauncey.  I don't believe anyone has confirmed his age at death, but since he has a son James I can see why this is considered.  Edward's will also references Jauncey heirlooms which he is passing on, so this also lends credence to the idea.  However, every attempt to position Edward in this family is a leap of faith in some direction - it is not an easy fit.

It seems possible that James is the name of Edward's father in law.  It is also possible that the Jauncey heirlooms came through her family, if we only knew who she was.

I have been spurred on to further research after DNA testing has showed a match with descendants of surname Garner from Shropshire and I am curious since I do not know of a link to that family.  However, I notice that Garners can be found everywhere that Pooles and Coopers can.

Where should I look for this information?  I was hoping the Rev Edward's wife's burial details would have something but it just says 'Widow of the Rev Edward Poole'.

The marriage record for James Poole and Anne Cooper likewise has no details to assist.

I have not located a marriage for Edward.  Are there missing records for Shropshire? 

I am reasonably certain of Ann's age at death, there are three unrelated documents which have her born either late 1747 or early 1748.  Therefore a likely birth for her is in Shrewsbury to John Cooper and Elizabeth Jones.  But I am not finding any confirmation of this either.

Does anyone know this family or know of a resource which might help me learn more?

Irene
O'Keefe Clare Ireland, Briers Leicestershire, Brown Fordham Cambridgeshire, McKinley Fermanagh, Cox from Windsor, Berkshire, Dunstall Sussex, Morey Dorset, Peard Fermoy, Dillane Limerick, Lockley Staffordshire, Cowen Birmingham, Bone Kent and many many more.

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Online garstonite

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Re: Reverend Edward Poole and his son James Poole in Caynham and Ludlow
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 24 September 14 08:42 BST (UK) »
where were Edward and Marys children born ??
added
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/J71N-9RJ  could this be a child of Mary b 1741 - no father named ???....
oakes,liverpool..neston..backford..poulton cum spittal(bebington)middlewich,cheshire......   sacht,helgoland  .......merrick,herefordshire adams,shropshire...tipping..ellis..  jones,garston,liverpool..hartley.dunham massey..barker. salford

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Offline larzus

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Re: Reverend Edward Poole and his son James Poole in Caynham and Ludlow
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 24 September 14 08:50 BST (UK) »
Edward's children Mary, Elizabeth and Frances were born in Caynham.  I have not located births for the younger ones but the Reverend Edward was Vicar at Caynham from 1759 till his death in 1776.  He was also a curate at Ludford.  He was Anglican.
O'Keefe Clare Ireland, Briers Leicestershire, Brown Fordham Cambridgeshire, McKinley Fermanagh, Cox from Windsor, Berkshire, Dunstall Sussex, Morey Dorset, Peard Fermoy, Dillane Limerick, Lockley Staffordshire, Cowen Birmingham, Bone Kent and many many more.

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Re: Reverend Edward Poole and his son James Poole in Caynham and Ludlow
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 24 September 14 08:57 BST (UK) »
I just added this to my last post
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/J71N-9RJ   could this be a child of Mary b 1741 ?
before she married Benjamin Biddulph ?
oakes,liverpool..neston..backford..poulton cum spittal(bebington)middlewich,cheshire......   sacht,helgoland  .......merrick,herefordshire adams,shropshire...tipping..ellis..  jones,garston,liverpool..hartley.dunham massey..barker. salford

Offline larzus

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Re: Reverend Edward Poole and his son James Poole in Caynham and Ludlow
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 24 September 14 09:11 BST (UK) »
The names, date and location fit my family.  It certainly is possible.  The family were quite respectable  and a bit stiff and my initial instinct was that surely it wouldn't happen in the family of a wealthy reverend.  However - the more I look at it the more plausible it seems. 

Two generations later, one of Caroline's daughters has a baby out of wedlock and I was just as surprised about that.  She had been engaged to a man but he clearly jilted her - only she was already in trouble by then.  The family kept her out of the way for a few years.  The child took the name of her husband when she married two years later.

Mary and Benjamin Biddulph did have a son Benjamin in 1774 but I have never seen a reference to this Edward.  I'll have a look through the records for him.
O'Keefe Clare Ireland, Briers Leicestershire, Brown Fordham Cambridgeshire, McKinley Fermanagh, Cox from Windsor, Berkshire, Dunstall Sussex, Morey Dorset, Peard Fermoy, Dillane Limerick, Lockley Staffordshire, Cowen Birmingham, Bone Kent and many many more.

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Re: Reverend Edward Poole and his son James Poole in Caynham and Ludlow
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 24 September 14 11:49 BST (UK) »
are you sure that Mary b 1741 married Benjamin Biddulph - according to this record , Benjamin was a Reverend as well and he marries a MRS Mary Poole at Ludlow - why wouldn`t Mary be in Caynham with her father in 1767 ??....and why does it say MRS Poole ??...Mary would be just Mary Poole spinster
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/NNQ8-LMQ
this doesn`t look like Mary Poole b 1741 - the daughter of Rev Edward Poole to me
any other members thoughts please ??
oakes,liverpool..neston..backford..poulton cum spittal(bebington)middlewich,cheshire......   sacht,helgoland  .......merrick,herefordshire adams,shropshire...tipping..ellis..  jones,garston,liverpool..hartley.dunham massey..barker. salford

Offline larzus

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Re: Reverend Edward Poole and his son James Poole in Caynham and Ludlow
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 24 September 14 12:08 BST (UK) »
It's an interesting thought but there is plenty of evidence.

James and Ann Poole had a daughter Caroline, who married Charles Stevenson and settled at Hennor House near Leominster in Herefordshire.  Their daughter Isabella emigrated to Australia.  Many of Isabella's letters and other papers are still with us today. 

Benjamin Biddulph the son of Benjamin and Mary (Cousin Biddulph in her letters) was the man who handled the Stevenson family's money.  There is one document signed by Benjamin Biddulph and there was a court case involving Caroline and her sister Jane over Jane's will, which refers to the new lawyer after the death of Benjamin Biddulph as being a man not related to the family and perhaps not so careful with their affairs.

Thus, I came to Mary being the daughter of Edward after I knew she was a cousin to the Stevensons.  At that point I located an entry in various peerage books (always of dubious accuracy I know) which stated Mary was the daughter of Edward Poole.

Finally, the Reverend Edward Poole in his will bequeathes money to ... my daughters Ann now the wife of the Reverend Mr John Taylor and Mary the now Widow and Relict of the Reverend Mr Benjamin Biddulph deceased

I wonder if it was anything to do with the child Edward?
O'Keefe Clare Ireland, Briers Leicestershire, Brown Fordham Cambridgeshire, McKinley Fermanagh, Cox from Windsor, Berkshire, Dunstall Sussex, Morey Dorset, Peard Fermoy, Dillane Limerick, Lockley Staffordshire, Cowen Birmingham, Bone Kent and many many more.

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Re: Reverend Edward Poole and his son James Poole in Caynham and Ludlow
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 24 September 14 12:42 BST (UK) »
"I wonder if it was anything to do with the child Edward?"
it certainly looks that way - and in my eyes would confirm that Edward was indeed the son of Mary b 1741 .....it would explain the MRS Poole - and maybe even why they married in Ludlow - away from Caynham for a reason ....
you have certainly done some great research ....I don`t suppose we will ever know ...but I think Edward is Marys child ....
a very interesting thread ....
oakes,liverpool..neston..backford..poulton cum spittal(bebington)middlewich,cheshire......   sacht,helgoland  .......merrick,herefordshire adams,shropshire...tipping..ellis..  jones,garston,liverpool..hartley.dunham massey..barker. salford

Offline larzus

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Re: Reverend Edward Poole and his son James Poole in Caynham and Ludlow
« Reply #8 on: Friday 28 November 14 07:50 GMT (UK) »
Just an update:

I have discovered Edward Poole the illegitimate son living in Stretton Grandison and referenced in Mrs Ann Poole's will in 1833 as being a 'near relation' to Benjamin Biddulph (not actually named as his half brother), so he lived to grow up and continued a member of the family.  I have not discovered any marriage or death for him yet.

James Poole married Ann Bennett and I have this now with plenty of evidence.  Ann came from Somerset and was the daughter of William Bennett Esq.  They were married in Somerset where James Poole is shown as Captain James Poole of the Parish of Ludlow.

I did want to properly identify Mrs Ann Poole since the Cooper option never seemed quite right, so I'm quite pleased to have resolved this matter.

I still have the huge mystery of the Reverend Edward Poole's wife.  She was a wealthy woman and obviously well connected, and it's a real puzzle to me that there is no record to be found - not an announcement, not a marriage settlement or a will - nothing to indicate her surname at all.  Perhaps they married out of the country?

I am continuing to work on this, and will update here if I learn more.  Hopefully someone with the answers will spot this thread and make a comment!  :)
O'Keefe Clare Ireland, Briers Leicestershire, Brown Fordham Cambridgeshire, McKinley Fermanagh, Cox from Windsor, Berkshire, Dunstall Sussex, Morey Dorset, Peard Fermoy, Dillane Limerick, Lockley Staffordshire, Cowen Birmingham, Bone Kent and many many more.