John Brown, Seaman, Ayrshire

[Kipper5]

Hello,

I am trying to link a John Brown as the father of a relative Alexander Brown..

John Brown was born in 1786 in Prestwick (maybe Loudoun), Ayrshire and was a Seaman.

He married Mary Shaw in Nov 1811 in Newton.

The 1841 census record has them in Newton with Alexander Brown.
In the 1851 census record they are in Wallaceton, Newton.

No sign of them in 1861.

But then in the 1871 census Mary is a widow, living in Troon with family. She died in 1877 in Troon.

I would like to know when John Brown died, presumably in Wallaceton (Wallacetown) in Newton, between 1851-1861. I'm not sure where his records would be..

Moreover, I would like to find if they had any children, in particular if Alexander Brown (born c1817 in parish Ayr) was their son.

Any help would be great, thanks..

[Br1gau]

Hello Kipper,

Have you considered this family tree?
http://trees.ancestry.co.uk/tree/62067230/person/30084171068

Note that it gives John Brown & Mary Shaw's marriage as 1817 in Monkton

[Gadget]

Hi Kipper

A death cert for Alexander would most probably give his parents's names and father's occupation.
added - Just seen that he might have died in Derry 


Gadget

[Kipper5]

Thank you, Gadget. Alexander Brown died in Derry in 1908. I wasn't sure how much info would be on the certificate but have recently sent off for it, with the hope that it would give his parent's info.

And Br1gau the marriage in that tree is right (I mistyped 1811 instead of 1817) but I'm trying to prove that Alexander is indeed the child of Mary and John.

Thanks.

[Br1gau]

Good luck, keep us posted!!

[Kipper5]

I received copy of death certificate of Alexander Brown, who died in Derry in 1908. But alas, there were no details of his parentage at all, just that he was 89 and that he was an iron founder.
A while ago I visited his grave in Derry and the records just gave the info that he was from Ayr and that his parents were John and Mary Brown.

I have up to now just guessed at his parents as being John Brown, seaman, born 1786, and his wife Mary nee Shaw, born 1796. This is based on the 1841 census of them in Newton, with Alexander, an iron founder.
I can't even find birth records of any of their children, so maybe I'm completely wrong.
Moreover, the best fit for Alexander's birth record I can find is with parents Alexander Brown and Isobel Ronald in Oct 1818, natural son. And I had wondered if maybe he had been brought up by other Brown relatives..
I'll keep at it..

[Br1gau]

This looks like the same Alexander Brown, engineer in foundry, at Derrybeg, Fruthill, Derry, aged 83 in the 1901 census,
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/reels/nai000616708/

He is shown as a visitor, born in Scotland but I’m wondering if he’s connected to another Brown family from Scotland, living at Foyle’s Road, Derry.  The mother/head of house is Agnes (76) and her two sons, Alex (52) & James (50) are both master engineers.
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/reels/nai000620930/

[Kipper5]

Yes, thank you Br1gau, that's him. In the 1901 census he's visiting his daughter Margaret Oliver in Derrybeg (my gt grandmother).
From what I've gathered Alexander was born in 1818 in Ayrshire and married twice. First to (I think) a Margaret Waugh in 1841, with whom he had 2 daughters, Elizabeth and Mary. She must have died (though I can't find any record of this). And then he married Agnes Stewart, with whom he had 9 children (John, Alexander, James, David Hepburn, Janette, Agnes, Robert Hamilton, Margaret and Jean). 2 were born in Scotland, but then they moved to Derry, where the others were born.

As I said the best record I have for his birth in Ayr is as a 'natural son' to Alexander Brown and Agnes Ronald. Yet when I visited his grave they said his parents were a John and Mary Brown.

Regards

[MonicaL]

....Yet when I visited his grave they said his parents were a John and Mary Brown.

And that is what you have to work from really  You have a good 1841 census entry for him (given his occupation). You then have him in 1851. Two marriages. Move to Derry and more children born there post 1851.

I am also wondering whether the reason you cannot see at least mother Mary Shaw Brown in 1861, may be because she could have been in Ireland? Came back by 1871 and staying with her brother in law in 1871 and then, as you have, died in 1877.

Monica