Italian Research

[steve62]

Hi Keelen,
Needle in haystack without a place of birth and 00/00/0000.  Even having this info it would mean trying the Provincial Archives who sometimes have info or Parocchial Archives for the area.  Not a big thing, but more long in time.  The local town halls only have info after the Unification of Italy.  Your ancestor was born before.

Italian records are very hard to find on the internet, with the exception "Family Search" who have some records.

John  would be Giovanni in italian.  On researching there appears to be no surname as "Guinari" or "Gavaneri". The surname "Guarniere" would appear to be from Northern Italy and predominantly for the Province of Lombardy.

The problem in the UK with foreign surnames is that officials tended to write the name as they heard it.  I have ancestors with eastern european surnames written in several ways.  My surname Boler started off as Bowler and over the centuries it went to Boaler/Bowler/Boler.  I have a Bowler married and his children go as Boaler and vice versa.  All confusing, but it makes it harder to research.  Managed to get back to 1605.

Sorry much help. but if you find something that might help drop me a line.

Steve

[rlw254]

I'd appreciate any advise from the Italian experts!

In my tree, Maria Messana (see note on surname at the end) was allegedly born in Salerno around 1845. Sometime before her marriage in 1870, she moved to San Severo. Her parents were Michele Messana (born 1817) and Antonia Consiglio (born 1817).

I know that Maria had at least three brothers - Francesco born in 1847 in Salerno, Salvatore born in 1849 in Quartiere San Giuseppe, Naples, and Pasquale born in 1854 in Salerno.

I've found baptism records for all three of the brothers, but not for Maria herself. Apparently the family moved around a bit between Naples and Salerno. Birth records in Salerno for the year of 1845 are not available on the Antenati website - are these available somewhere else or have they been destroyed?

I don't yet have the date of her death (she would have died in San Severo), but no useful information is included in her marriage record or publication.

Her father Michele is another issue for me, as it seems he was born in Caltanissetta, Sicily. This surname has been written as Messano in several documents from Salerno, but Messana seems to be the predominant spelling in this area of Sicily. Michele does not show up in baptisms for the town of Caltanissetta itself in 1817, so it's likely that he was from a village in this region. Ravanusa and San Cataldo seem to have the most Messana people. I also do not know when Michele died but I believe it was before 1879 in Salerno. I cannot find a record of his marriage to Antonia Consiglio.

Ultimately I am looking for Maria's baptism so I can help trace Michele's family farther.

[steve62]

rlw254,
Don't worry about the surname ending in an "a" or "o".  Thats due someone misspelling and won't affect research.
Baptism papers for Maria in 1845 Salerno.  They will most likely be Church records.  Will write to the diocesean Archives for Salerno and hopefully they will search with just a year.  They like 00/00/0000.
Death date - afraid not possible, because no one will search without a date.
Michele Messana b. 1817 Caltinasetta.  Again will try the diocesean Archives with just a year.
As to his Death date ditto as for Maria.
Marriage of Michele and Antonia in Salerno 1870.  These records will be with the town hall registrar in Salerno as it was after the Unification of Italy.  Will write and again hopefully they will search with just a year.
As mentioned in previous posts its sometimes difficult to get info, because they don't reply.  Frustrating I know.

Steve

[rlw254]

Thank you for your advice!
Right now I believe Michele died in Salerno between 1870 and 1879. State records available on Antenati do not include 1877 or 1878 and I did not find the death in any other year in this range.

In 1870, marriage of Maria: "... figlia naturale di Michele Messana e Antonia Consiglio, ambo residente in Salerno"
In 1879, marriage of Pasquale: "... figlio di fu Michele residente in -----, e di Antonia Consiglio, residente in Salerno"

[steve62]

Let's see what I can gain in info first as I have e mailed for info as mentioned above and then we will take from there.
Soon as I hear will let you know.

Steve

[rlw254]

Looking again I was able to find Michele Messano's death in Salerno in 1872, it gives his parents as Michele and Grazia Rondinella, birthplace Caltanissetta around 1815. I am still unable to find this in Caltanissetta church records available at familysearch.org. Hopefully the church can provide more information  about him or his daughter

[mixedupmob]

Hi Steve

I was wondering if you could get a couple of marriage records for me please. The bride in both marriages is Marta Lucia DeCampo. From her birth registration record it looks like she married a Stefano surname I cannot read on or about 14 March 1911 (I think) and the other marriage took place on 21 June 1922 to Giuseppe Maganetti - both marriage appear to have taken place in Tirano. I am hoping the parent's names of the bridegrooms will be shown on the registrations. Attached in a copy of Marta's birth registration obtained from FamilySearch's Italian records for Tirano. I have a copy of her first marriage so do not need it.

Thanks for your help.

R.

[steve62]

Hi mixedupmob,
Looks like the marriage was 14/03/1915, because looking at the "1" in the other its differant.  Surname of Stefano magnified looks like "Cestini" to me.
Will e-mail Tirano for the MC, but the marriage in 1922 does'nt look like Tirano the way it is written.  Could be wrong, but will request as Tirano all the same.

Steve

[mixedupmob]

Thanks Steve, look forward to to the replies you get.

R