Author Topic: William Stewart and Ann Edward(s)  (Read 3389 times)

Offline Craigellachie2019

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William Stewart and Ann Edward(s)
« on: Wednesday 18 February 15 11:40 GMT (UK) »
I know this couple were the parents of my Great Grandfather William Stewart who married Isabella Smith. There is a gravestone erected by Ann after the death of her husband William aged in his late 20s in 1857 not long after the birth of young William. I have searched Scotlandspeople for a marriage for William and Ann - the birth of William Snr and his death in 1857 as noted on the Kinnedar headstone. Why wouldn't I be able to find his death record - and marriage and birth?  I have seen the Descendants of John Stewart tree by John Lovie and also the Lossiefowk site by Donnie Stewart and they trace William Snr back to John Stewartand Janet Crockett and one more generation back to John Stewart and Isabella Edward but I can't get the searches to prove it. Any ideas ?
Scotland: Stewart, Smith, Edward, Barron, Macdonald, Sinclair, Millar/Miller, Ross, Salmon(d), Cuthel, Cuthill, Macalister, McAlaster, McAllister, Forsyth, Haddow, Todd, Aitken, Gartshore, Mackie, Strang
England: Lucas, Parkinson, Nicholls
Ireland: Keys, McAuliffe, Achilles, Fenner/Fannin, Halpin
Germany: Achilles, Bartels, Barthold, Pralow, Schreiber, Kloth, Cords

Online Forfarian

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Re: William Stewart and Ann Edward(s)
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 18 February 15 12:46 GMT (UK) »
Why wouldn't I be able to find his death record
You have, of course, checked all the possible spelling variants, and you have checked every William S who died in Scotland in 1857 (because ages are not shown in the index at SP).

I see from the 1851 census that the only William Stuart of the right age in the parish of Drainie is a 19-year-old fisherman with parents John and Janet, several siblings and a visiting Margaret Edward, 18. Is your one listed as a fisherman on his son's birth certificate?

It is possible that William died while away fishing somewhere away from home. The herring boats tended to follow the herring as they migrated up and down the coast, and William could have met with an accident almost anywhere on the east coast of Scotland or England. There are four deaths of William S in England in the second (June) quarter of 1857, one each in Fareham, Liverpool, Hull and Penrith, and again ages are not listed. English death certificates don't list the parents of the deceased, and I am unsure whether they give the name of the deceased's spouse in 1857, so you would need to rely on the date of death to be sure you had the right one.

I believe that in England you are allowed to ask the Registrar a question before actually having to pay for the certificate. You could try contacting the relevant Registrars and saying, "I am looking for the death certificate of William Stewart or Stuart who died on 25 June 1857 aged 26. Is the one who died in xxxx in the June quarter of 1857 the one I want?" If they reply that he is not, then you can save the cost of buying the wrong certificate.

Quote
and marriage and birth?
The short answer is because these events were either not recorded, or if they were the record has not survived. There could be any number of reasons for this

I note from the index at SP that only two of the children of John S and Janet Crockett are listed, Janet b 1821 and Isabel b 1823. These match the family listed at Lossiemouth in the 1841 census consisting of John, 38, fisher; Janet Crockett, 40; Janet, 20; Isabella, 18; John, 15; Jane, 13; William, 10; James, 7; Ann, 6: Alexander, 3; Hellen, 1. The family in Lossiemouth in 1851 consisting of John, 49; Janet, 49; Jane, 22; William, 19; James, 17; Alexander, 12 and Charles, 7 matches the younger children in 1841, so I think it's reasonable to conclude that William who married Ann Edwards is the son of John S and Janet Crockett.

However it is clear from this that John S and Janet Crockett that only the first two of ten children are in the parish register. If it had been just one or two missing, it could have been that the clerk forgot to make the record, but when it's almost a complete family, one has to conclude either that the parents omitted to have them baptised (unlikely) or had them baptised but omitted to have the event recorded. This could be because they belonged to a religious denomination other than the Church of Scotland. (Not, of course, the Free Church of Scotland, which was set up in 1843.)

However as far as I am aware all the likely non-C of S registers in the area have been filmed for the Elgin Local Heritage Centre, and indexed on LIBINDX. So barring a lost register turning up somewhere, I think you may just have to accept that there is no surviving record of the birth or baptism of your William S or at least seven of his siblings.

Similarly with the marriage, which probably took place just before the start of civil registration on 1 January 1855.

The previous generation should be easier. Janet Crockett died in 1900, and LIBINDX gives her parents as William Crockett, fisherman, and Janet Young. It doesn't give a date of death for John S, but as he is in the 1861 census, you should be able to find both death certificates to confirm their parents' names.
Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.

Offline Annette7

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Re: William Stewart and Ann Edward(s)
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 18 February 15 15:35 GMT (UK) »
You will find William's death recorded as William STUART in 1857 at Drainie, Moray.

The certificate shows him as 27, Fisherman, Married (though wife's name not given), died 25/6/1857 Brandenburgh (? hard to read), son of John Stuart, Fisherman and Janet nee Crockert.   Cause of death 'Disease of spine, for some years'.   Is shown as buried Kinnedar.   The informant is his father John Stuart, Fisherman of Lossiemouth.

Annette
Scopes (One-Name Study - Worldwide)
Suffolk - Grist, Knights, Bullenthorpe, Watcham
Scotland - Spence, Horne, Cowan, Moffat
London -  Monk

Don't walk behind me, I may not lead.   Don't walk in front of me, I may not follow.   Just walk beside me and be my friend.

Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Annette7

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Re: William Stewart and Ann Edward(s)
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 18 February 15 16:00 GMT (UK) »
This is his parents marriage:

John Stuart and Janet Crocket 2/3/1820 Drainie (on SP).

Annette
Scopes (One-Name Study - Worldwide)
Suffolk - Grist, Knights, Bullenthorpe, Watcham
Scotland - Spence, Horne, Cowan, Moffat
London -  Monk

Don't walk behind me, I may not lead.   Don't walk in front of me, I may not follow.   Just walk beside me and be my friend.

Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Offline Annette7

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Re: William Stewart and Ann Edward(s)
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 18 February 15 16:06 GMT (UK) »
John Stewart, Fisherman, of Lossiemouth died 30/1/1878 aged 75 - married to Janet Crocket.   Cause of death 'General Debility and old age'. Son of John Stewart, Fisherman, deceased and Isabella nee Edward, deceased.  Informant son John Stewart, Fisherman.

Annette
Scopes (One-Name Study - Worldwide)
Suffolk - Grist, Knights, Bullenthorpe, Watcham
Scotland - Spence, Horne, Cowan, Moffat
London -  Monk

Don't walk behind me, I may not lead.   Don't walk in front of me, I may not follow.   Just walk beside me and be my friend.

Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Craigellachie2019

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Re: William Stewart and Ann Edward(s)
« Reply #5 on: Thursday 19 February 15 11:15 GMT (UK) »
Forfarian - thank you for your very informative reply. I will print it out and keep for future reference. I had searched using wild card and also the phonetic versions but had found no results that would fit. Based on your information from the census and Annette's information, today I was able to find them on Scotlandspeople. I ran out of credits but will add more on the weekend when i go home and will buy the documents and add to my family.
Annette thank you for all your hard work and enabling me to verify at least 2 more generations of my Stewart family. Including myself makes 7. Still only back to 1700s though. Will keep going though. Thanks again
Anne
Scotland: Stewart, Smith, Edward, Barron, Macdonald, Sinclair, Millar/Miller, Ross, Salmon(d), Cuthel, Cuthill, Macalister, McAlaster, McAllister, Forsyth, Haddow, Todd, Aitken, Gartshore, Mackie, Strang
England: Lucas, Parkinson, Nicholls
Ireland: Keys, McAuliffe, Achilles, Fenner/Fannin, Halpin
Germany: Achilles, Bartels, Barthold, Pralow, Schreiber, Kloth, Cords

Online Forfarian

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Re: William Stewart and Ann Edward(s)
« Reply #6 on: Thursday 19 February 15 18:24 GMT (UK) »
Sorry, finger slipped!
Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.