Author Topic: Elusive Hannah Wiltshire  (Read 2366 times)

Offline Earlsdau

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Elusive Hannah Wiltshire
« on: Thursday 12 March 15 15:36 GMT (UK) »
Hello all,

I have a very elusive person who I think is unfindable with the available online BDM resources. Perhaps by searching other records she may be found but I am not in the UK and so do not have the luxury of spending time at the Gloucestershire Records Office or Heritage Offices local to Winchcombe/Ashchurch etc.

She is the mother of the below mentioned George WILTSHIRE. I do not have a surname nor a marriage date for her and Robert WILTSHIRE.

- George WILTSHIRE born c1811, probably in or around Winchcombe, Gloucestershire. - I can find no Baptism date or record for George.
- Died 23/02/1874 aged 62. Buried Winchcombe, Glos.
- The 1851,61 & '71 Censuses indicate he was born in Winchcombe, Glos.
- Confirmed father - Robert WILTSHIRE 1773-1835. Bapt 21/03/1873 Ashchurch, Glos.
- Non confirmed mother - Hannah UNKNOWN ?-1811. Buried 3/04/1811 Winchcombe, Glos.
- Subsequent (?) Marriage of Robert WILTSHIRE and Rachel DREWETT 29/03/1812 Winchcombe, Glos.

As I see it, if this Hannah is George's mother, he would have had to be born sometime between 24/02/1811 (if his death cert age is correct) and 2/04/1811 (at the latest).

I do not think that Rachel DREWETT is George's mother, although I have no conclusive evidence.

I would appreciate any assistance with this one if possible.....although I'm not very hopeful -  ???

Earlsdau

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Offline Victor Harvey

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Re: Elusive Hannah Wiltshire
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 14 March 15 14:48 GMT (UK) »
Hi Earlsdau,
Now that the Gloucestershire PRs are on A******y, I checked to see if I could find a baptism for George WILTSHIRE. I then checked the transcriptions on A******y and found Robert WILTSHIRE son of Hannah WILTSHIRE baptised 3rd April 1811. These transcriptions are somewhat suspect, having been transcribed in China, so I decided to check the microfiche record.
Source: Glos Archives (GA) PFC 368 IN 1/5 6, St Peter, Winchcombe, PR:-
3rd April 1811, Hannah, wife of Robert WILTSHIRE, buried.
I could find NO record of a baptism for George WILTSHIRE on the A******y website.
Victor
HARVEY, Guiting Power, Glos                     
PORTER, Gunmakers of Whitechapel
ALLEN - Blockley, BOWLES - Notgrove, BURROWS - Sevenhampton, COOK - Notgrove, DRINKWATER-LUNN - Aston Cross, FARDON - Temple Guiting, FAULKNER - Cheltenham, GADEN, GAYDEN, GAYDON, GRINHAM - Cheltenham, HART - Stow-on-the-Wold, LANE - Staverton, MOABY - Coln St Aldwyns, STAITE - Temple Guiting, TIMBRELL - Winchcombe, TYSOE - Warks & Glos, WHITFORD - Stanway, WINTLE - Forest of Dean, WYNNIATT - Stanway

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Offline Earlsdau

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Re: Elusive Hannah Wiltshire
« Reply #2 on: Sunday 15 March 15 11:48 GMT (UK) »
China....you gotta be kidding? Well that explains it! I have come across countless errors like burials being called baptisms etc in the 2-3 weeks that these records have been online. Also what hope have our Chinese friends got of knowing old names like Philemon and Zachariah, in fact, I don't think a lot of English speaking transcribers know the old names and therefore can't interpret them well.....

....having said that, the benefit of having the Gloucestershire BDM records online now has almost outweighed the errors 😃 and some areas of my fact finding has advanced significantly. So not complaining really.

Thanks anyway. Your conclusions are my conclusions .....in that the answers are either unable to be found or perhaps are to be found elsewhere.

Offline Victor Harvey

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Re: Elusive Hannah Wiltshire
« Reply #3 on: Sunday 15 March 15 13:03 GMT (UK) »
Hi Earlsdau,
Take my advice and only trust the digitalised PRs searched for by individual parishes. These are the actual PRs and can be trusted. The transcribed Chinese records should always be checked against the digitalised records.
Victor
HARVEY, Guiting Power, Glos                     
PORTER, Gunmakers of Whitechapel
ALLEN - Blockley, BOWLES - Notgrove, BURROWS - Sevenhampton, COOK - Notgrove, DRINKWATER-LUNN - Aston Cross, FARDON - Temple Guiting, FAULKNER - Cheltenham, GADEN, GAYDEN, GAYDON, GRINHAM - Cheltenham, HART - Stow-on-the-Wold, LANE - Staverton, MOABY - Coln St Aldwyns, STAITE - Temple Guiting, TIMBRELL - Winchcombe, TYSOE - Warks & Glos, WHITFORD - Stanway, WINTLE - Forest of Dean, WYNNIATT - Stanway

Online Annette7

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Re: Elusive Hannah Wiltshire
« Reply #4 on: Sunday 15 March 15 13:44 GMT (UK) »
Think I may have solved the mystery albeit not the discovery of George's baptism.

From his marriage to Rachel we know that Robert was a widower when they married in 1812.

Robert Wiltshire had served in the 40th. Regt. of Foot (shown as born 1773 Winchcombe (spelt Wenchcome), Glos. and was discharged 4/2/1799 Chelsea, London due to 'left leg poisoned by weeds in St. Vincent).

Just one month later he appears to have married at Chelsea, London:

Transcibed on Ancestry as:

Robert Wilkshire, soldier to Hannah Duret/Durst 6/3/1799 Chelsea, London.

On familysearch Hannah's surname transcribed as Duret, on Ancestry Durst.   However, she actually signed the register and signs as 'Hannah Druitt' and her surname is quite clear.

So, with Hannah's surname Druitt and Rachel's Drewett could they possible be sisters (or maybe cousins)?

Where any children born to Robert and Hannah between 1799 and 1811 occurred I can't say (could have been anywhere) but it does seem extremely likely that Hannah Druitt was his mother and no doubt related somehow to his stepmother Rachel Drewett.  Perhaps the family only returned to Winchcombe ca.1811 with Hannah's impending death - who can say? - so George could have been born anywhere but only thought he was born in Winchcombe since that is where he was raised from a baby.

Annette


Scopes (One-Name Study - Worldwide)
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Scotland - Spence, Horne, Cowan, Moffat
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Don't walk behind me, I may not lead.   Don't walk in front of me, I may not follow.   Just walk beside me and be my friend.

Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Earlsdau

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Re: Elusive Hannah Wiltshire
« Reply #5 on: Sunday 15 March 15 15:11 GMT (UK) »
Awesome information Annette!

May I ask you your sources so I can check them? The original image of the Winchcombe marriage of Robert WILTSHIRE and Rachel DREWETT in 1812 does not state he was a widower and that is the only one I have seen. Believe me I looked for it on the original hoping it would confirm a previous marriage but there is no comment written there. Hopefully you have seen the Banns original image or another source!

I am indebted to you for all this information as I have been struggling for awhile to make headway here.

Offline Earlsdau

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Re: Elusive Hannah Wiltshire
« Reply #6 on: Sunday 15 March 15 15:27 GMT (UK) »
My baseline Victor is unless I see an original image/s and the information/data must tie together from usually three other sources/angles I don't accept it or at least hold it at arms length.Wills, census, military, place names, names of subsequent generations etc etc etc. are all part of reaching a conclusion.

Paid researchers I have not found to even be very effective and accurate at times.

Online Annette7

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Re: Elusive Hannah Wiltshire
« Reply #7 on: Sunday 15 March 15 20:08 GMT (UK) »
Sorry to omit the sources - I was about to go out and wanted to post before I left.

The marriage of Robert and Rachel is on Ancestry and it is the actual copy of the register and clearly states Robert Wiltshire, of this parish, widower and Rachel Drewett, of the same, spinster so don't understand how you say it wasn't there on what you viewed.

The first marriage in Chelsea is also on Ancestry under Robert Wilkshire and Hannah Durst (although original entry clearly shows she signed as Hannah Druitt).

The brief service record for Robert Wiltshire is on FindMyPast.

I've also noted that Rachel Wiltshire didn't die until 1862 and census shows her to have been born in Shiplake, Oxfordshire ca.1778 so one would assume in this instance that probably Hannah Druitt was born in Oxfordshire too.

Annette
Scopes (One-Name Study - Worldwide)
Suffolk - Grist, Knights, Bullenthorpe, Watcham
Scotland - Spence, Horne, Cowan, Moffat
London -  Monk

Don't walk behind me, I may not lead.   Don't walk in front of me, I may not follow.   Just walk beside me and be my friend.

Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Earlsdau

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Re: Elusive Hannah Wiltshire
« Reply #8 on: Monday 16 March 15 00:59 GMT (UK) »
Again thank you 😅 for the sources and info!

This is the kind of thing that is exciting to find (and it happens frequently in genealogical research) but for this one I must have been too locked in to Gloucestershire and surrounding counties....a good reminder again!

I hadn't seen that marriage record which you had seen. Yes it is quite clear that he was a widower which is what I had suspected. The other records I have found which circle back nicely to Winchcombe. Without that Military record it would have been harder to connect conclusively the correct Robert WILTSHIRE.

Now for some more research into the DREWETT/DRUITT girls/families!