John Welsh wool weaver of kilbarchan

[blacksmithy]

Good evening
I am trying to find the whereabouts of John Welsh born 1855 in Kilbarchan to Sarah McArthur and William Welsh.  Sarah died in 1866 and William married for a second time to France/Jane/Fanny (MS Hannah) in 1868.  She was the daughter of Claude and Jane (MS Mc?Pherson) and seems to have used the various Christians names over time.  She was born in Johnstone.

I have traced John in the 1871 Census and his occupation is a Wool Weaver and his older brother is an ?Engine Emita (later a blacksmith).  The 2 other half siblings on the page do not stack up name wise so I think they are a transcription error on ancestry, but the DOB years do.  In this census record he refers to his mother as France Welsh (and not Sarah I guess because she is died and his father remarried).

In 1878 John was the informant of his fathers (William) death on 5 December.  William and Jane (MS Hannah) lived at 12 Stook Street Paisley and John his son lived at 9 Galloway Street Paisley.

This is the last I can find of John. I have not found him in the 1881 Census and cannot find a death or immigration for him.

I did wonder if he left Scotland and went to New Zealand. 
His big sister Agnes (b1846) married William Kennedy and went to NZ with his 2nd sister Jane/Jean (b1853) who married Thomas Elwood Lyle - they travelled out on the same ship called the Napier in 1879.  His big brother William (b 1849) the Engine emita/blacksmith also went to New Zealand.  Williams travel details are unknown however he marry Rhoda Niblett in South Canterbury NZ in April 1878 and set up a blacksmith business in Pleasant Point Canterbury NZ.

I am very keen to find John as I would then have located all of Sarah and Williams children.  I have not followed up on the children of his second marriage as they fall outside my line of family.   I should note however that in the 1891 census of Scotland Jane now aged 51 is living at 56 George Street Paisley as a greengrocer along with her children: George born Kilbarchan 1870, Alexander born Paisley 1875 and Mary born Paisley 1877.  Jane died in 1911 and her son George was the informant.

Thank you for your time in reading this, any tips, clues etc. will be gratefully received.
Cheers
Blacksmithy

[greeneyedgirl]

Hi, are you sure that John was born in Kilbarchan as I looked up births and could not locate any children in Renfrew to William & Sarah even though they were married in Kilbarchan in 1843 and in a later census William says he was born in Kilbarchan. I found a John Welsh in 1881 in Wallsend,Northumberland,England working as a ships painter.Also a John in Philadelphia in 1880 US census working as a carpet weaver & married to Martha from Scotland. As to him going to New Zealand,there are 11 marriages for John Welsh in NZ records and 24 deaths from 1880-1930 in NZ. The website www.dia.govt.nz/Births-deaths-marriages has all the BMD for NZ.As to William being born in Kilbarchan, I checked 1800-1830 in both Catholic records and parish registers. In parish registers,there was only one record of a William being born in Renfrew and that was in 1822 in Greenock and in Catholic records there were 2; one in 1822 in Greenock and one in 1816 in Paisley. I'm not sure what you should try next but maybe review all you have and see if something may need to be changed. Sorry couldn't be of more help,Kim

[blacksmithy]

Hi Kim
thank you for your thoughts.  I found a reference to Johns birth on Ancestry saying his dob was 28 March 1855 at Kilbarchan to Sarah McArthur and William Welsh, hence my thoughts in this area.  I have been through the NZ BDM and thought that I had my man and an age of death match an 1855 birth but again it was incorrect and my financial punt was wrong sadly.  I am interested in your John who married Martha and wonder if you can tell me if this marriage took place in Scotland or the States as I could not find either.  I did look in the The Watt Library index of family history notices - Intimations, in a hope that their marriage would feature there - but again no luck.  I have found other family members there but this branch is very elusive.  Looking forward to hearing from you again.
Regards
Blacksmithy

[greeneyedgirl]

Hi, looking at the census of 1880 in the US, John Welsh and his wife both claim to be born in Scotland yet in the 1900 census they both say Ireland. I could not find a marriage for them either in Scotland or Pennsylvania but they could have married in New York or whatever place they met before Pennsylvania.
A tree on Ancestry says born Kilbarchan and in 1881 was in England and was with the Royal Navy.That was the only info the tree had on him. I looked at this and it is possible but you'd have to go further to see if it is actually him. The problem really is the fact that John & Welsh are very common names and with Welsh depending on who was recording an event, it could be transcribed as Welsh/Welch/Walsh so it is very hard to determine who may be correct without tracing down each possible.
I did find the births of 3 children;
Agnes born 18 May 1846 Kilbarchan
William born 10 March 1849 Kilbarchan
Jean born 15 February 1853 Kilbarchan
*all born to William Welch-Sarah McArthur

1881 Scotland census:
John Welsh
age:30 born @ 1851 Barrhead,Renfrew
living Kilbarchan,Renfrew
lodger with Fergus family
occ:general labourer
*this may be your John. I know it says born Barrhead but there is no birth of a John Welsh in Barrhead to any parents between 1830-1854. Also, he may not have been the one to give the census info.

another interesting guy;
1891 Scotland census
Paisley,Renfrew
James Welsh
age:32 born @ 1859 Kilbarchan,Renfrew
occ:gardener assistant
Annie Welsh
age:28 born @ 1863

there are a couple of John's in the 1891 census which could be him-one is age 37 & married to Margaret and the other is John with wife Agnes and son Robert age 5.

I also found this:
John Welsh
naturalization indexes
living at 4 Bartlett Place, Boston
born in Scotland
on 18 Sept 1855
naturalized on 23 October 1885

There are so many John Welshs you will just have to follow them down to see if he is yours. Sorry that there isn't much more definite but I would make sure that he actually wasn't still in Scotland. Possibly in Paisley. Kim

[blacksmithy]

Hi Kim
thanks for your extensive research.  I will certainly follow-up on the Barrhead John and also the one in Bartlett Street Boston.  You are so right that there are so many John Welchs and all their variations, it has been a long but interesting journey for me.  Oh for a Sophia or Matilda or Paul!!
Your first list of 3 children are his siblings. the gardener John is a cousin and the royal navy one is also a relative (which confused me to start with).  Time to go back to writing up the family research I know and somewhere along the light I might have a light bulb moment based on your information.
Again thank you for the time you have given me 
Blacksmithy

[greeneyedgirl]

Hi, no problem. If you get any oter info let me know and I will look some more. Good Luck,Kim