Author Topic: Newtownards/BallyBlack Paisleys  (Read 8615 times)

Offline whiteout7

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Re: Kilmood
« Reply #9 on: Wednesday 17 June 15 06:32 BST (UK) »
I found this to, posting it since Pittsburgh is in Ohio?

Deaths 1894, PAISLEY: November 14, at the residence of her grandmother, 38 Lodge Avenue, Cleveland, Ohio, Margaret Jane Campbell (Paisley), dearly beloved daughter of Thomas James and Jennie Paisley, aged three years and three months.

http://www.irelandoldnews.com/Belfast/1894/DEC.html

So I wonder if they link back to your Paisleys, since they put this in the Irish papers?



 
Wemyss/Crombie/Laing/Blyth (West Wemyss)
Givens/Normand (Dysart)
Clark/Lister (Dysart)
Wilkinson/Simson (Kettle or Kettlehill)

Offline aghadowey

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Re: Kilmood
« Reply #10 on: Wednesday 17 June 15 08:11 BST (UK) »
Pittsburgh is in western Pennsylvania not Ohio.

You can now check GRONI's index and then view certificates online (as with Scotland's People website) so there's no waiting for certificates to arrive in the post  :)

The Paisley/McMillan marriage is here but since the extract doesn't list their father's it is possible that those names are also omitted from the original certificate-
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FGNM-RM5
David's marriage also doesn't show parents in the extract-
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FGN9-QL2

Here's Hugh's marriage announcement in the Belfast Newsletter (18 Dec.1846) but fathers aren't listed-
On the 11th inst., in the Second Presbyterian Church, Bangor, by the Rev. Samuel Hamilton, Mr. Hugh Paisley, Conlig, to Miss Eliza M'Millen, Drumahirk.

Added-
... my David Paisley and Agnes Gamble, who married in December 1846 at the Newtownards register office, were both said to be of Drumhirk.  Unfortunately, his marriage certificate says his father is unknown, so I suspect he was illegitimate.
Blank space for father's name on marriage certifcate does not indicate illegitimacy. It was not uncommon for father's details to be omitted on early certificates if father was deceased or clergy simply didn't ask the question and record the information. As marriages usually take place in the bride's church, the minister may or may not have been personally acquainted with the groom's father.
Away sorting out DNA matches... I may be gone for some time many years!

Offline aghadowey

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Re: Kilmood
« Reply #11 on: Wednesday 17 June 15 08:19 BST (UK) »
I found this to, posting it since Pittsburgh is in Ohio?
Deaths 1894, PAISLEY: November 14, at the residence of her grandmother, 38 Lodge Avenue, Cleveland, Ohio, Margaret Jane Campbell (Paisley), dearly beloved daughter of Thomas James and Jennie Paisley, aged three years and three months.
http://www.irelandoldnews.com/Belfast/1894/DEC.html
So I wonder if they link back to your Paisleys, since they put this in the Irish papers?

Thomas James Paisley's 1920 passport application "to visit aged mother" lists his birthdate as 16 Apr.1867 He died 9 July 1964 and wife Jennie was also born in Ireland.
This seems to be his birth in Doagh, Co. Antrim district even though it's James Thomas Paisley and the little daughter who died in 1894 is named after his mother-
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FR9P-FYL
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Offline aghadowey

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Re: Kilmood
« Reply #12 on: Wednesday 17 June 15 08:51 BST (UK) »
Something to file in case a connection is later found-

Belfast Newsletter, 11 Feb.1834: On 27th ult. after a tedious illness, which she bore with christian fortitude, Nancy, wife of James Paisley, Drumhi_k, parish of Newtownards, aged 80 years; much lamented by an affectionate husband and filial family- yet resigned, having strong consiolation that her soul has winged its way into the glorious and much desired presence of her Redeemer.
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Offline Carolynxyz

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Re: Kilmood, now Newtownards/Ballyblack
« Reply #13 on: Wednesday 17 June 15 18:26 BST (UK) »
This is all very interesting.  I have seen the Ohio Paisleys but haven't yet connected them to County Down. I have focussed more on the Pittsburgh ones, although it may be pure coincidence that David and Agnes' son, Hugh, went out briefly to Pennsylvania (1880 census for Union Town).  He went to work in the coke pits there but returned to Durham through lack of work a few years later.  I had wondered if perhaps a second cousin in Pittsburgh had alerted him to the brief boom in the coke industry, but it may be that Hugh responded to a newspaper advertisement. I know Durham coal miners were favoured.

I am very interested in the 1834 obituary. It is quite possible that these are the parents of Samuel, who died in 1819 aged 48 and John who died in 1870 aged 90.  These are the earliest Paisleys I've found so far.  Samuel had a son James. I had searched the British Library newspaper database on FindmyPast, but this obituary is not included.  There is an extremely interesting report in 1841, however, detailing how a deputation of tenants of the Marquis of Londonderry was sent to console him after his mansion was destroyed by fire at Wyngate Park and to reassure him of the affection they had for him.  They and the Marquis both comment on the wonderful relationship they share and the respect they have for each other. This seems to have been in contrast to other places.  The minister and a layman of each area were chosen to be representatives, with a Mr Paisley being a layman representative of Newtownards (suspect he is David Paisley of Ballyblack, who later married the minister's daughter.)  This all gives further credence to the family story that says Londonderry brought out some of his tenants to the Durham coal pits at the time of the famine.  I understand Scribo Tower was also built to show gratitude for the Marquis's kindness to his tenants during the famine.

Could I please ask where you got the information you provide for the marriage of Hugh Paisley and Eliza McMillan?  I note that the father's names aren't given, but perhaps the certificate might.  The same source does not show parents for David and Agnes, yet the actual marriage certificate names her father as John Gamble, labourer.  But I take note of what you say, and it is quite possible that David's father was dead.  The Newtownards Paisleys appear to be a highly respectable bunch, so illegitimacy is perhaps  less likely. They were married in Newtownard's register office, not Agnes's local church, so I believe David genuinely did not know his father's name.  One of the possibilities I'm mulling over is that his parents were a William and Susanna (this being the William of Drumhirk, Kilmood, granted a gun licence  between 1832  and Feb 1836) who, as a widow, may have married a John Whitla(w) of Drumhirk.  It gets very confusing with there also being a townland named Drumhirk in Newtownards.  However, David's marriage certificate states Drumhirk, Kilmood, and in October 1866, David and Agnes are back in Drumhirk, Kilmood, where Agnes delivers twins.  I cannot find out what became of them, but it appears they died, for they are not on the 1871 census in County Durham, nor are they in English civil registration indexes.  I can only think David and Agnes went back to Drumhirk, Kilmood, to visit relatives and Agnes gave birth prematurely perhaps. 

I have a lot of leads to follow up now, thanks to this list.  But first I have to sort out how to order certificates online. When I was looking for deaths for the twins,  I registered with GRONI, but they were asking for a specific date, which I couldn't supply.  I couldn't see how to do general searches, but I obviously need to look harder.  I'd love to know where the Hugh/Eliza information came from too.

Once again, thank you to you all for all your help.  It certainly makes a difference brainstorming like this.
Carolyn

Offline Carolynxyz

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Re: Kilmood
« Reply #14 on: Wednesday 17 June 15 18:38 BST (UK) »
Sorry.  That's Wynyard Park not Wyngate Park, and it was one of the Marquis's estates in County Durham.

Does anyone know how I can change the name of this thread from Kilmood to Newtownards/Ballyblack?

Offline aghadowey

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Re: Kilmood
« Reply #15 on: Wednesday 17 June 15 20:16 BST (UK) »
I have seen the Ohio Paisleys but haven't yet connected them to County Down.
The Ohio Paisleys seem to be from Co. Antrim (north of Belfast). See reply #11

Could I please ask where you got the information you provide for the marriage of Hugh Paisley and Eliza McMillan?
The marriage announcement is from the Belfast Newsletter (date given).

When I was looking for deaths for the twins,  I registered with GRONI, but they were asking for a specific date, which I couldn't supply.
GRONI's online database allows you to search within a 4 year period so you can just keep searching by changing the date range. For an early death you should first search Irish civil registration index on Family Search to narrow down the possibilities. They also have some extracted deaths 1864-1870 which is worth checking. Note: birth certificate will list place of birth and father's usual residence if different (providing information has been supplied to the registrar).

Does anyone know how I can change the name of this thread from Kilmood to Newtownards/Ballyblack?
Just click on 'report to moderator' to ask for the title to be changed.
Away sorting out DNA matches... I may be gone for some time many years!

Offline whiteout7

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Re: Kilmood
« Reply #16 on: Wednesday 17 June 15 21:40 BST (UK) »
I found this:
Placename: Drumhirk    
County: Down    
Civil Parish: Kilmood    
Poor Law union: Newtownards    
Registrars :District: Kilmood    
Registrar: Lewis

http://www.irishtimes.com/ancestor/fuses/plu/index.cfm?fuseaction=rdtownlands&rdid=272&REGISTRARS_DISTRICT=Kilmood

I think Drumhirk in Kilmood and Drumhirk in Newtownards are the same place. Am I wrong?

So some of your events could have been happening in Drumhirk but merely registered in Newtownards.
Wemyss/Crombie/Laing/Blyth (West Wemyss)
Givens/Normand (Dysart)
Clark/Lister (Dysart)
Wilkinson/Simson (Kettle or Kettlehill)

Offline aghadowey

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Re: Kilmood
« Reply #17 on: Wednesday 17 June 15 22:00 BST (UK) »
Away sorting out DNA matches... I may be gone for some time many years!