Succoth or Sucoll, The Cabrach, Aberdeenshire

[AncesStory]

I may have found her.

Don

This baptism record is for Mary Bain, daughter of John Bain,   Hilcorf  (LEOCHEL-CUSHNIE). Do you think the census return for 1851 should have been Leochel rather than Succol or Succoth? The age is right - according to the  1841 census Mary Stewart nee Bain was age 65 (b 1775) and her husband Peter Stewart was 70, born 1771 (actually 1772).

It may be that the Succoth from 1851 census is actually Sochaugh or Hill of Cushnie (Leochel-Cushnie, Aberdeenshire)?

https://books.google.com/books?id=fA5KAAAAMAAJ&pg=PA497&lpg=PA497&dq=Sochaugh,+cushnie,+aberdeenshire&source=bl&ots=B5LX0uUIrq&sig=ar4EhXpOvcjIJLJAcb2BO3rZUxY&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0CCsQ6AEwAmoVChMIh4agnLD5xwIVSlQ-Ch0mJAK4

Any thoughts on this?

[Forfarian]

This baptism record is for Mary Bain, daughter of John Bain,   Hilcorf  (LEOCHEL-CUSHNIE). Do you think the census return for 1851 should have been Leochel rather than Succol or Succoth?

I read the place as Hillocks rather than Hilcorf.

As to whether it should be Leochel rather than Succoth in the 1851 census, I incline to Succoth - the writing is fairly clear and reads Sucoll. I can't make it look like Leochel by any stretch of the imagination. Bain is not an uncommon name.

Wherever she came from, there is no such parish as Succoth or Sucoll, and the instructions to enumerators were that the parish of birth should be recorded, so wherever it was, it shouldn't have been there at all. The birth parish would have been much more helpful, naturally. 

[AncesStory]

Succoth is a placename found in several areas in Scotland: The Cabrach area - Glass, Aberdeenshire and Mortlach, Banffshire; Cushnie, Aberdeenshire; Dallas, Morayshire, Argyllshire to name a few. In  Aberdeenshire there are places known as Socach, Strathdon; Socach Mor, Braemar; Soccoth, Cabrach; Sockaugh/Socach, Tarland* -  Applies to a high eminence near mountains between Glen Ernan & Glen Nochty, and the boundary between the parishes of Strathdon & Tarland*.

Sochach is derived from a gaelic word for snouted, beaked.
 Socach. A certain extent of arable land. A point of land jutting out between two rivers (Gaelic)

I have focused on Aberdeenshire, because the county was given as Aberdoon.My problem has been accessing documentary sources for Mary Stewart nee Bain other than the 1841 census returns for Cargill Parish. Perthshire - as a wife of Peter Stewart, age 65, and as a widow and mother of David Stewart, age 75. According to the 1851 census, Mary Stewart nee Bain was born in Succol, Aberdoon.

The birth record offered by DonM is for a Mary Bain born 23 October 1783, daughter of John Bain of Hilcorf/Hillocks/? in Leochel Cushnie, Aberdeen. There is a place name of Sochaugh also known as Soccoch, at Hill of Cushnie, Leochel and Cushnie.

There were no Bain families living in Succoth, The Cabrach, at the time Mary Bain would be born. Shands are recorded as being born at Sockach in the 1790's, (James Shand is recorded as living there 1841-71 censes). Combies also, and prior to the Shands, Horns.

Searches for Mary's death record on SP have proved difficult. Son David Stewart was married by 1861 and living in Burreltown with his wife Mary Nichol, without his mother. Mary Stewart does not appear in any census I can find after 1851, so I assume she died sometime between 1851 and 1861. Her death record may produce evidence of her birthplace, if she died after 1855.

I welcome any thoughts on this conundrum.

[jennywren001]

It's worth having a look on Freecen for Adam Street in Cargill for 1851.  There would appear to be quite a  few errors in the census returns with subsequent corrections made in the transcriptions. The original has Kapeth for Caputh and Edinburg for Edinburgh.

They appeared to be at ease with writing Westmorland - Ravenstonedale correctly and equally at ease locating Bendochy in Angus. I wonder what 'Sucoll Aberdoon' sounded like to their ears?
Jen

[DonM]

As I said I may have found her, but you might never find definitive proof it is actually her.  "If" the family followed the Scot's naming pattern then the children might help identify her father/mother.

I don't see any MI's in Cargill for a Stewart/Bain but that doesn't mean she is not buried there. The Perth Archives have the burial registers enquiries@pkc.gov.uk However, keep in mind this register may not have anything to help you other than when she died and when she was buried.

Don

[AncesStory]

Thanks all - I am inclined to think the Cushnie baptism record for 1783 may be the "right" one, but it may be that her birth was never recorded.

Also, there seems to be no marriage record for Mary Bain and Peter Stewart in Perthshire or Aberdeenshire, let alone in Scotland at the time there would be one - around 1808ish. I only found three births relating to this couple, but there may have been more - Isobel Stewart, baptized 29 October 1808, Thomas Stewart, baptized 28 October 1811, Strelitz, Cargill and David Stewart, baptized Cargill Parish 26 April 1813.

I will try looking for possible parents using the naming pattern - maybe Mary's mother was named Isobel? If the couple followed the traditional naming pattern for their children,  Peter's father would be named Thomas, yet  I cannot find a Thomas Stewart in Kinclaven as the father of Peter Stewart c 1770- only Donald Stewart+ Isabel Young  who baptized a son Peter  18 Jul 1772?

I think I need to search again for the death record for Mary Stewart nee Bain and contact the A K Bell library who may have some information on the couple.

Many thanks all.