Author Topic: Beatrice Elizabeth Park and Elizabeth Shiel.  (Read 4773 times)

Offline julie7239

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Re: Beatrice Elizabeth Park and Elizabeth Shiel.
« Reply #27 on: Monday 02 November 15 12:48 GMT (UK) »
  Does it list her father??

I haven't yet had chance to go back to the library to look at Ancestry, but I did find Rebecca's parents names.  Rebecca Hartley Wool, born 1854, parents William Hartley Wool and Elizabeth Hanby.

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Offline Kay99

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Re: Beatrice Elizabeth Park and Elizabeth Shiel.
« Reply #28 on: Monday 02 November 15 13:05 GMT (UK) »
That agrees with the family I found - I think this is them in 1861 living in Lewisham.

William H Wool 36 b Hammersmith Tailor
Elizabeth Wool 32
Elizabeth Wool 10  b Lyme? Norfolk
Rebecca Wool 7 b Lewisham
Rosanna Wool 4 b  Lewisham

Have you tried using Family Search https://familysearch.org/search if you don't have access to Ancestry at the moment?? Edit -It's free

Kay


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Offline julie7239

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Re: Beatrice Elizabeth Park and Elizabeth Shiel.
« Reply #29 on: Tuesday 03 November 15 13:33 GMT (UK) »
I am so curious about the personality of Rebecca Hartley Wool, and who these two men were, Samuel Alexander Park, Beatrice's stepfather, and Thomas Wilson, Beatrice's biological father. 

I found this on the family search website (from the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints).
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:2DJW-T5R

It is the marriage of Samuel Alexander Park to Rebecca Hartley Wool in Apr-May-June 1884, registration district Islington, county London, volume 1B, page 612.  Witnessed by Mary Ann Blankey and Robert Murray Hunter.

I clicked Samuel's name for further information about him on this site, and the same man's birth registration Apr-May-June 1851 Greenwich, London, volume 5, page 273, line number 2.

It does look as though this is the same Samuel Park as you mentioned who passed all those seaman's masters certificates, first as second mate and then as first mate.

Rebecca was born in 1854, so she was 30 at the time of the marriage to Samuel in 1884, and he was 33.

Rebecca is listed as a widow in the 1891 census (where her age is given as 32, which seems wrong as she would have been 37).  So Samuel Alexander Park would have died some time between 1884 and 1891, but I can't find any reference to a death certificate, though I haven't found a death certificate reference for Rebecca either.

Samuel Alexander Dalton Park was born In Greenwich, Kent, England in 1851 to father George Park, born 1812 in Edinburgh, Midlothian, Scotland, who died 10th March 1891, Plymouth, Devon.  And his mother was Sarah Armstrong, born 1811, Coldstream, Scotland, died 1882, Plymouth, Devon.

On the 1861 census for Samuel, he is shown as aged 10, and his mother Mrs Sarah Park age 45, born Coldstream, Scotland.  She is listed as head of family, husband away.  It is a handwritten document so I struggled to read the husband's occupation, but I think it said engineer.  Address given as Lower Maryon Road, Woodland House.

With the Plymouth connection, I am guessing that this Scottish couple moved to Greenwich, where Samuel was born, with the husband's seafaring job.

I felt so sad to think that this wonderful man, Samuel, who worked hard for those seaman's certificates and took on a struggling single woman with two children, giving them his name, just died so soon after qualifying as a first mate.

There seems to be something strange and maybe vulnerable about Rebecca.  I did manage to look at the tree you gave me the url to, and Vivien's comments that no father is given on Beatrice's birth certificate, but Rebecca gives her name as Thomasina Wilson.  Rebecca seems to have given a wrong age on at least two censuses, and as Samuel's widow is calling herself Clara.

I have pages and pages of notes, and need to think carefully about the information as it has red herrings.

I think the only information I don't already have that would be on Samuel and Rebecca's 1884 marriage certificate would be his father's name and occupation.  Which would give the correct Samuel Park.

But the elusive Thomas Wilson is altogether more difficult, and it looks as though people on the Ancestry site have made best guesses as to what was going on.

Offline julie7239

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Re: Beatrice Elizabeth Park and Elizabeth Shiel.
« Reply #30 on: Tuesday 03 November 15 14:23 GMT (UK) »
Somebody, a Canterbury expert, very kindly gave me some information about the marriage of Harry Rolls to Beatrice Elizabeth Park on November 18th 1897 in the parish church of St. Stephens, Hackington, Canterbury, Kent, by the vicar Rev. Frederick Harrison Hichens MA.

Beatrice, aged 21, was living in the parish of St Stephens at the time.  Harry, aged 24, was a Corporal in the Royal Scots Greys, 2nd Dragoons, who were based in Edinburgh at the time, and Harry himself was also based in Edinburgh at the time of the marriage.  He was signed up for the army on 24th October 1892 for a 12 year term, aged 19 years and 8 months.  He was an ironworker, like his father Benjamin, born in Bradley, Staffordshire.

I do remember somebody saying Harry was in India in the army, and I read that at one time, but obviously not at the time of the marriage as they were based in Edinburgh, the Royal Scots Greys were in Canterbury for something to do with India.

Offline julie7239

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Re: Beatrice Elizabeth Park and Elizabeth Shiel.
« Reply #31 on: Tuesday 03 November 15 15:30 GMT (UK) »
The other information she gave me was that on the 1891 census, living at 45 Baxter Road, Islington, London, were Clara Park, head, widow age 32, born Lewisham.  Herbert W Park, son, single, age 15, Provision merchant's assistant, Bloomsbury, London.  Beatrice E Park, daughter, single, age 14, born Chelsea.  And Harry Thompson, boarder, single, age 24, warehouse clerk, born Canterbury.

So it looks as if the Canterbury connection is Harry Thompson, and maybe the reason Beatrice was living in Canterbury age 21.

(Rebecca was born in 1854, so she was 37, not 32).  (And why is she suddenly calling herself Clara?)

Offline Kay99

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Re: Beatrice Elizabeth Park and Elizabeth Shiel.
« Reply #32 on: Tuesday 03 November 15 15:58 GMT (UK) »
Goodness knows why Rebecca is listed as Clara in 1891, but I can't see another explanation. Clara might have a nickname :-\   Great having such an interesting family :)

Harry Rolls military record is on FindMyPast and it lists him as serving in South Africa from 1899 - 1902

Offline Kay99

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Re: Beatrice Elizabeth Park and Elizabeth Shiel.
« Reply #33 on: Tuesday 03 November 15 16:26 GMT (UK) »
I am so curious about the personality of Rebecca Hartley Wool, and who these two men were, Samuel Alexander Park, Beatrice's stepfather, and Thomas Wilson, Beatrice's biological father. 

I found this on the family search website (from the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints).
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:2DJW-T5R

It is the marriage of Samuel Alexander Park to Rebecca Hartley Wool in Apr-May-June 1884, registration district Islington, county London, volume 1B, page 612.  Witnessed by Mary Ann Blankey and Robert Murray Hunter.

I clicked Samuel's name for further information about him on this site, and the same man's birth registration Apr-May-June 1851 Greenwich, London, volume 5, page 273, line number 2.

It does look as though this is the same Samuel Park as you mentioned who passed all those seaman's masters certificates, first as second mate and then as first mate.

Rebecca was born in 1854, so she was 30 at the time of the marriage to Samuel in 1884, and he was 33.

Rebecca is listed as a widow in the 1891 census (where her age is given as 32, which seems wrong as she would have been 37).  So Samuel Alexander Park would have died some time between 1884 and 1891, but I can't find any reference to a death certificate, though I haven't found a death certificate reference for Rebecca either.

The other couple listed here aren't witnesses at the wedding of Samuel and Rebecca in 1884 they were the other couple who got married with the same marriage reference number

Samuel Park might not have died by 1891 although Clara/Rebecca lists herself as a widow!  There is a potential Samuel in 1911 who lists himself as a Naval Pensioner :-\

There is a possible death for Rebecca H Thompson  - age 68  June Qtr 1923 Islington Volume 1b Page 285

Offline julie7239

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Re: Beatrice Elizabeth Park and Elizabeth Shiel.
« Reply #34 on: Tuesday 03 November 15 19:08 GMT (UK) »
Rebecca seems to have been happy with Harry Thompson for the rest of her life, they are together on the 1911 census, Rebecca Thompson age 57, Harry Thompson age 44, and Herbert Park age 34.  Living at 62 St Pauls Road,, Canonbury, Highbury.  I think it is her who died June 1923, Islington, age 68, and Harry Thomson, born 1867, died aged 59, Islington, March 1926.

Rebecca's mother Elizabeth died in 1875, when Rebecca was 21.  A year before Beatrice was born.  William Wool remarried and in the 1881 census, age 54, has a new wife Lydia age 33, and two small children.

Offline julie7239

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Re: Beatrice Elizabeth Park and Elizabeth Shiel.
« Reply #35 on: Thursday 12 November 15 20:03 GMT (UK) »
I found something that made me wonder, probably somebody else completely, but there is a Rebecca Park, age 25 in 1879, on the patient admissions register for the London Bethlem hospital.  She seems to have had a brief stay.  I found that on the Find My Past website using the library's subscription.  I don't know where I would find any more information.

If it is her, considering that she didn't marry Samuel Park until 1884, age 30, this would be evidence that Samuel Park was the biological father of the children, that she was already using his name.

Maybe, maybe not.