Author Topic: Alexander Duff, Auchindachy, Keith, born 1807  (Read 5717 times)

Offline Fordyce

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Re: Alexander Duff, Auchindachy, Keith, born 1807
« Reply #9 on: Wednesday 09 December 15 17:43 GMT (UK) »
J11, you're quite right that Antenuptial Fornication was fornication before a marriage. But Isobel Gordon wasn't the other guilty involved - it was Janet Cruickshank, the mother of Helen Duff.

The full quote, dated 11 Dec 1837, is "Compeared Alexander Duff, Cooper, Muir of Rhynie, guilty of antenuptial fornication. He was rebuked, exhorted and absolved from church censure." The Banff Kirk Session had dealt with matters as recorded there on 22 Jun 1835. As I mentioned previously, on 25 Dec 1834 Alexander Duff had married Isobel Gordon, who of course was not named in the KS. Helen Duff was born in that summer of 1835, so was conceived in the autumn of 1834 the act thus being 'antenuptial'.

On the surface, it's taken some 2 and a half years for the Huntly KS to catch up. I have no explanation for this, other than that I've been told that the Kirk Session records for Huntly for 1826-1836 are missing. I've found no evidence of there being more one cooper in Huntly in 1834/35/36, never mind named Duff let alone named Alexander Duff; on the contrary, implicit in Janet Cruickshank accusing "Alexander Duff Cooper at present in Huntly" without qualification is that there was one and only one of that description, also that he wasn't always in Huntly is implied by the phrase 'at present'.

I'll probably never know what went on that summer of '35. Janet Cruickshank was "exhorted to reflect seriously upon her situation" (being her sixth-lapse in fornication *), and maybe she did, for by 1841 she was married to a John Hardie seven years her senior and they lived in Carmelite St in Banff without further progeny until their deaths in 1870/71 (by which time, Helen Duff had continued in her mother's footsteps). Maybe Alexander Duff scarpered in fright with Janet Cruickshank in hot pursuit seriousliy reflecting upon his position; maybe he was two-timing; maybe her accusation in Banff came as a terrible surprise. Maybe Isobel Gordon was steaming mad, maybe not. Who knows?!

* I know about two of her lapses, another three are possibles, the remaining one (and any others that escaped the KS's beady eyes) is entirely unknown.

I'm personally confident that I talking about one person; it'll need new hard evidence for me to reconsider; it's his parentage that is the puzzle. I did say he was probably born in Banffshire: true enough, but I feel he was born in Banff itself - being 'Duff country', being a cooper by trade perhaps down by the harbour, and where Janet Cruickshank had lived for some years, and where the father of her fourth lapse was a shipmaster named George Hutton (and I try not to read too much into that...!)

Offline GR2

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Re: Alexander Duff, Auchindachy, Keith, born 1807
« Reply #10 on: Wednesday 09 December 15 18:14 GMT (UK) »
Sometimes if there is serial fornication, the kirk session refers the case to the presbytery. Although it doesn't seem to have happened for child number six, another session may have referred her for the fifth one.

Offline Forfarian

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Re: Alexander Duff, Auchindachy, Keith, born 1807
« Reply #11 on: Wednesday 09 December 15 23:13 GMT (UK) »
THat's odd. I am under the impression that antenuptial fornication, by definition, can only have occurred if the parties were subsequently married, because if they didn't marry it was ordinary fornication plain and simple, not antenuptial fornication. So if Alexander Duff and Janet Cruickshank were guilty of fornication but did not marry one another, it cannot have been antenuptial, there not having been any nuptials in the interim.
Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.

Offline Fordyce

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Re: Alexander Duff, Auchindachy, Keith, born 1807
« Reply #12 on: Thursday 10 December 15 10:39 GMT (UK) »
Yes, it is odd, but when he was compeared he had just left the parish, he was married, and his misdemeanour was before his marriage, and was in Banff. By not mentioning his (innocent) wife, maybe the KS didn't have a full grasp of the situation or they were being circumspect. With the relevant KS records missing, we'll never know what they considered earlier.

I haven't been through the Presbytery (of Strathbogie) and the Synod records for this case, but the one time I found a case submitted by a KS to the Presbytery, their deliberations, if any, were never minuted. So, unless I'm at the NRS for something else, I'm afraid it's not high on my list.

As for the so-called fifth lapse, there are simply no known candidates. There's an extreme outside chance it was her first lapse, when she would have been 18 or less and still at home in Knockorth Marnoch, with the child being brought up by her parents - but I discount this for several reasons, not least that there's no credible evidence.


Offline Forfarian

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Re: Alexander Duff, Auchindachy, Keith, born 1807
« Reply #13 on: Thursday 10 December 15 12:35 GMT (UK) »
the one time I found a case submitted by a KS to the Presbytery, their deliberations, if any, were never minuted.

No. I have one case that was referred to and from the KS to the Presbytery several times. The Presbytery didn't seem to come to any decision - just kept referring it back to the KS to 'get more evidence'.
Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.

Offline Fordyce

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Re: Alexander Duff, Auchindachy, Keith, born 1807
« Reply #14 on: Thursday 10 December 15 15:01 GMT (UK) »
the one time I found a case submitted by a KS to the Presbytery, their deliberations, if any, were never minuted.

Sorry, I didn't phrase that as well as I might - it wasn't intended to be a generalisation - it was the one specific case I came across in the Kirk Session that was referred to the Presbytery.

After a series of minutes from Jan 1857 to Dec 1859, the final KS minute on the subject has:  "...George Clark still persisting in his former declaration of innocence and in his desire to receive the oath was summoned by the Modr to appear before the Presbytery of Strathbogie at Huntly on the first Wednesday in December next" (1859). This was a particularly serious accusation by his niece concerning him, her married uncle, which perhaps destroyed his wife Elspet Geddes because she died in the middle of it all. In the end, I am left with the suspicion that it was her brother with whom she had the child in question (and, yes, there is evidence), and George was innocent. Whatever the true story, the Presbytery (and the Synod) records are silent, as are all the Kirk Sessions that might have got themselves involved (Grange, Alvah and Rothiemay) after that final minute. 

So, if one event, especially of such a nature, doesn't get minuted, it follows that other events won't get minuted either. I do not suggest that all events won't get minuted.

The child in question married three times, once to his cousin, had one child, and died in 1938 in Keith at the good age of 81.

Offline jennywren001

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Re: Alexander Duff, Auchindachy, Keith, born 1807
« Reply #15 on: Friday 18 December 15 12:02 GMT (UK) »
Hi Fordyce,
Hariot Moir with the Duffs in 1841 - do you know who she was?  I know it describes her as a servant but wouldn't be the first time a servant/boarder/pedlar turned out to be a relative. Harriot's not what you'd call a very popular Scottish name of the time - only 31 Har* females showing for the whole of Banffshire in 1841.
Jen
North East Scotland above the Tay...
JOLLY, Johnston,Thom, Rae, Davidson, Fielding, Sherret
FEARN, McKenzie, Stirling [brick wall], Robb, Wilson, Stott
RUSSELL, Fullerton, Christie, Cochrane, Davidson, Coutts, Easton, Scott
FRASER, Henderson, Noble, Mundie, Goodall, Thain, Neish, Moir

Offline Forfarian

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Re: Alexander Duff, Auchindachy, Keith, born 1807
« Reply #16 on: Friday 18 December 15 13:05 GMT (UK) »
she was married to a John Hardie seven years her senior and they lived in Carmelite St in Banff without further progeny until their deaths in 1870/71 (by which time, Helen Duff had continued in her mother's footsteps).

Just had a peek at the 1861 census - surely all those grandchildren can't be Helen's offspring?

Do you happen to know who the parents of Janet Cruickshank were? She's probably not one of mine, as the 1861 says she was brn in Marnoch, but just in case ....
Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.

Offline Fordyce

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Re: Alexander Duff, Auchindachy, Keith, born 1807
« Reply #17 on: Friday 18 December 15 13:50 GMT (UK) »
Just had a peek at the 1861 census - surely all those grandchildren can't be Helen's offspring?

Do you happen to know who the parents of Janet Cruickshank were? She's probably not one of mine, as the 1861 says she was brn in Marnoch, but just in case ....

Correct - only William Henderson was; the two named Tennant were children of Isabella Hutton,  Helen's half-sister, now married by then living in Edinburgh. The two Hendrys were children of John Henry [sic] & Charlotte Grant, one or the other apparently a child of John Hardie, although they are elusive after 1851.

Janet Cruickshank was born 23 Jun 1800 Marnoch, illeg d/o Robert Cruickshank in Recloth & Isobel Wilson in Foggieloan. I believe she was brought up on the father's side. Robert Cruickshank married Jean George and had a good sized family in Bogs of Laithers, Turriff, then Knockorth, Marnoch. I've got a good deal of info on them and other Cruickshanks nearby but haven't yet nailed them all down yet. I also have more info on mother Wilson but again it is pending-work-in-progess.