Author Topic: John Mumford m. Frances Hau??? in Ladbroke, child christened in Harbury  (Read 2392 times)

Offline jonw65

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Re: John Mumford m. Frances Hau??? in Ladbroke, child christened in Harbury
« Reply #9 on: Saturday 30 September 17 14:11 BST (UK) »
It's a burial at Knowle, 29 August 1707
Mary w of Henry Aubert

as in wife I should think

Image is available on FamilySearch if logged in (you need to register or be registered)
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-6XMQ-X1H?i=33&cc=1462403&cat=269102

On the next image
1710
Frances D of Tho: Aubert Bapt Aprill 30th

Offline lucymags

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Re: John Mumford m. Frances Hau??? in Ladbroke, child christened in Harbury
« Reply #10 on: Saturday 30 September 17 14:20 BST (UK) »
Ah, great, thanks for that Jon. (I can see it now, but couldn't find it via the search - not indexed in FS, it seems.)

The wrong Mary, unfortunately. :( But at least it rules her out.

Offline lucymags

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Re: John Mumford m. Frances Hau??? in Ladbroke, child christened in Harbury
« Reply #11 on: Sunday 01 October 17 09:03 BST (UK) »
Hmmm, actually now that I am looking more closely at that sequence of records, jon, there are some of interest, if a little confusing.  ???

Thomas Aubert and Mary Terr(e)y both of Knowle, married 29 June 1706. (image 33, rhs)
Hannah, daughter of Thomas Aubert, baptised 28 June 1707 (image 34, lhs)
Mary, wife of Henry Aubert, buried 29 Aug 1707 - Affadavit was made (image 34, lhs)
Henry Aubert & Elizabeth Sneth(?) married 5 April 1710 (image 34, rhs)
Frances daughter of Thomas Aubert baptised 30 April 1710 (image 35, rhs)
Henry Aubert buried 9 May 1710 (image 35, rhs)
Hannah daughter of Thomas Aubert buried 26 May 1710 (image 35, rhs)

(And I have found some records relating to 2 sons of a Nikolas/Nicholas Terrey/Terroy a bit earlier, 1701 & 1703, no mother mentioned.)

I'm going to dig around a bit more in that set of records, but wondering if Thomas and Henry were brothers, and perhaps the record relating to Mary's burial is a mistake and should have read wife of Thomas instead?

Offline jonw65

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Re: John Mumford m. Frances Hau??? in Ladbroke, child christened in Harbury
« Reply #12 on: Sunday 01 October 17 22:25 BST (UK) »
Hi
Aubert seems to be quite a difficult name to get to grips with.
It's certainly a pity that they didn't name the mothers in Knowle!
It seems to make sense if it's Henry's wife that died, as it's a Henry Aubert who married Elizabeth Sneth (in 1708!). Although it doesn't tell us that he was a widower.
Then a Henry Aubert dies in 1710.

There's a marriage at Lapworth, 24 Dec 1711
Thomas Luckman of this parish + Elizabeth Albert of Knoll
They actually give a link for this image
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-6SKS-M4W?i=105&cc=1462403

So possibly she might have been the widow of Henry?
John


Offline lucymags

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Re: John Mumford m. Frances Hau??? in Ladbroke, child christened in Harbury
« Reply #13 on: Monday 02 October 17 07:11 BST (UK) »
Yes, could well be, as it seems that Aubert did morph into Albert over time (and/or vice versa, if this is to be believed: http://www.surnamedb.com/Surname/Aubert - although here's a different version of its orgins: https://www.houseofnames.com/aubert-family-crest).

Only now I'm further confused, having scrolled forward and found a son of Thomas Aubert buried 15 April 1711 - no name, possibly stillborn (img 36, rhs) and another son, Edward, baptised 14 Aug 1714 (img 37, rhs - name looking a bit like Aubrett or Arbutt, but probably Aubert). These would have been after the death of the Mary who died in 1707, but I haven't seen him re-marry before them. Always possible that I missed something though.

And I passed by an Elizabeth Smith in the earlier records - probably that one that looks like Sneth. (And found a couple of sons of Nicholas Terr(e)y/Terroy and a daughter Elizabeth, but a bit too late to be the same generation as Mary Terrey.)

Yes, it would be a LOT easier if they listed the women's names, who after all did all the hard work of carrying and bearing the babies!!  :)

I guess there's nothing for it but to put my nose to the grindstone and trawl through some more records...

[Edit: Oh, and there was also a son Joseph, of Henry Albert born 23 Oct 1701 - either a previous wife, or not Henry Aubert this time, although I don't recall spotting any other Alberts.]

[Another edit: nothing yet, but note the baby born at the top left of image 37, where the mother's name is given, but the child labelled a Bastard - although can't quite read the name or the words beginning with "w". :-\]

Mel

Offline jonw65

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Re: John Mumford m. Frances Hau??? in Ladbroke, child christened in Harbury
« Reply #14 on: Monday 02 October 17 21:04 BST (UK) »
Hi
I would think that Henry and Thomas were two different people. Henry died,but Thomas carried on having children in Knowle (possibly with Mary)
I suppose it's just possible that Henry might have been the father of Thomas, but of course he may have been a brother.
Baptism 28 Dec 1690 at Knowle (image 21)
Susanna the daughter of Henry Awbut

and going back a bit more,
26 July 1687
Anne the daughter of Henry Awbutt

But then it is a very long gap to the baptism of Joseph in 1702 that you found!
John

Offline jonw65

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Re: John Mumford m. Frances Hau??? in Ladbroke, child christened in Harbury
« Reply #15 on: Monday 02 October 17 21:21 BST (UK) »
Marriage at Knowle, 20 October 1686 (image 18)
Henry Awbut + Mary Taylor
both of Knolle

(so much for the father of Thomas idea!)
John

Offline lucymags

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Re: John Mumford m. Frances Hau??? in Ladbroke, child christened in Harbury
« Reply #16 on: Tuesday 03 October 17 10:43 BST (UK) »
Hi John

Oh, thanks very much for spotting and posting those. I remember seeing quite a lot of Taylors, but must have missed the "Awbut"s. I'll have to come back to this with fresh brain and eyes when I have time and sketch out the Aubert family connections before putting the records up online, I think.

(In the meantime, last night I got somewhat sidetracked by following up some of the Mumfords on Frances' husband's side - much easier to track because indexed and mostly spelt correctly on the transcriptions.)

Cheers,
Mel

Offline lucymags

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Re: John Mumford m. Frances Hau??? in Ladbroke, child christened in Harbury
« Reply #17 on: Friday 06 October 17 14:21 BST (UK) »
Well, I've now put together the various Aubert family links together. I think it's still a possibility that Thomas is the son of Henry, but I cannot find proof of Thomas' origins at the moment, so will reconsider that next time I come back to it. At the moment I've left him as brother.

The first mention is of Henry marrying Mary Taylor in Knowle in October 1686. This would fit with his leaving France after the Edict of Fontainebleau in 1685 which removed the Huguenots' protections.  So Henry may have been born between, say, 1646-1666.

Henry and Mary have Anne, Susanna and Joseph, before Mary dies in late 1707. Henry marries Elizabeth Smith (Sneth) in 1708, but dies 2 years later in 1710. (Elizabeth may have remarried, to Thomas Luckman, in Lapworth.)

Thomas Aubert marries Mary Terr(e)y in 1706 - so he may have been born 1666-1686. They have Hannah (dies aged 3), Frances (may have gone to Ladbrooke and married John Mumford at age 28), infant who dies young, then Edward in 1714. No further record of Edward as yet.

As yet no record of burial for Mary, wife of Thomas, but I think it is he who goes to London and remarries in 1728, to Anne Poret, and has another son, Barthelemy Thomas. (There are various records from the French Huguenot church there.)