Please help me find parents of George Ogston born between 1820 and 1822

[Richard Nunes]

My wife's (Hilary Ogston) great great grandfather was a George Ogston born between 1820 and 1822 and died on Dec 8 1888. He married Ann Warrender (born in 1810) on  May 4 1846 in the Parish of Old Deer. Ann died on May 4 1895.  George and Ann had 2 children, George (b 1847) and William (b 1850).

The family believes that gg grandfather George was born to a John Ogston who married Isabella Sangster. However I am totally flummoxed and have hit an immovable dead end. I cannot find any credible links to this man. I am a member of Ancestry.com and have tried other sites (Family Search, Find a grave, FreeCEN) without success.

Thanks in advance.
Richard Nunes

[GR2]

George's death certificate should give you the names of both his parents. This is available through the Scotlandspeople site for a very modest cost, especially as you have a date for the death. There are lots of references on Rootschat for how to access Scotlandspeople.

[flst]

Hi, and welcome to rootschat. What does George's death certificate say? You say the family believes his parents to be... does that information come from the certificate? Sometimes the informant doesn't get the facts right. Have you searched for possible siblings?
flst

[Richard Nunes]

George's death certificate should give you the names of both his parents. This is available through the Scotlandspeople site for a very modest cost, especially as you have a date for the death. There are lots of references on Rootschat for how to access Scotlandspeople.

GR2 - Thanks for responding so promptly. A first cousin of my wife's did some research a few years ago and located the death certificate of my wife's gg grandfather. I do not have a copy of it but I have in writing that the certificate indicated that George's parents were John Ogston and Isabella Ogston. I guess where I am stymied is the next level up. I am not sure whether the John Ogston
(husband of Isabella) is the same one identified as being one of the children of a William Ogston (from Affedes) and his wife Janet Mores (from Fraserburgh). The latter John was baptised June 1 1788.
Thanks a million
Richard

[Richard Nunes]

Hi, and welcome to rootschat. What does George's death certificate say? You say the family believes his parents to be... does that information come from the certificate? Sometimes the informant doesn't get the facts right. Have you searched for possible siblings?
flst

Flst - thanks for your speedy response. 
A first cousin of my wife's did some research a few years ago and located the death certificate of my wife's gg grandfather. I do not have a copy of it but I have in writing that the certificate indicated that George's parents were John Ogston and Isabella Ogston. I guess where I am stymied is the next level up. I am not sure whether the John Ogston
(husband of Isabella) is the same one identified as being one of the children of a William Ogston (from Affedes) and his wife Janet Mores (from Fraserburgh). The latter John was baptised June 1 1788.
I did search for possible siblings for gg grandfather George without success.

Thanks a lot,
Richard

[Annette7]

I don't think the John you seek is the one who's a son of William Ogston and Janet Mores of Affedes in Strichen.   Affedes appear to be a farm and occupied by a John (a farmer) and Isabel (nee Chalmers) in 1841 - however, they have a son George who is only 5 (14 in 1851) so this John and Isabel cannot be your George's parents.

According to the death certificate of George his parents are indeed given as John Ogston and Isabella Sangster - both are shown to be deceased but John's occupation given as Woollen Weaver.

Can find no marriage between these two, nor can I find any other children born to such a couple.   Something to bear in mind is that in Scotland a child can be born out of wedlock and grow up with the surname of their father which could possibly be the case here.

Annette

[GR2]

Finding George on the censuses will indicate the parish of his birth. That will take you further forward. There is always the possibility that a parent or other relative might be staying with him, which would help too.

One thing to bear in mind is that the parish registers are for the Church of Scotland. Quite a few folk in that area were members of the Episcopal Church.

Many handloom weavers had small crofts, so can appear as weavers, crofters, agricultural labourers or even farmers on different documents.

[Forfarian]

I am a member of Ancestry.com and have tried other sites (Family Search, Find a grave, FreeCEN) without success.

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=714261.0

When you get that death certificate. Look carefully at how George's mother's name is recorded.

If she is described as 'Isabella Ogston M S xxx' the implication is that she was Isabella xxx.  (M S Stands for 'Maiden Surname'.)

If she is described as 'Isabella Ogston', the implication is (i) her maiden surname was Ogston and (ii) George was illegitimate.

If she is descrbed as 'Isabella xxx',  the implication is (i) her maiden surname was xxx and (ii) George was illegitimate.

However the validity of the information is dependent on the informant getting it right.

I see from a transcription of the 1881 census that George gave his place of birth as Old Deer. It is possible that there could be something in the Old Deer Kirk Session records. These are held in the National Records of Scotland in Edinburgh. They can be consulted in digital form in Edinburgh, Glasgow, Aberdeen, Hawick and possibly one or two other places, but are not yet accessible online.

And of course his parents may not have belonged to the Church of Scotland.

[Richard Nunes]

I don't think the John you seek is the one who's a son of William Ogston and Janet Mores of Affedes in Strichen.   Affedes appear to be a farm and occupied by a John (a farmer) and Isabel (nee Chalmers) in 1841 - however, they have a son George who is only 5 (14 in 1851) so this John and Isabel cannot be your George's parents.

According to the death certificate of George his parents are indeed given as John Ogston and Isabella Sangster - both are shown to be deceased but John's occupation given as Woollen Weaver.



Can find no marriage between these two, nor can I find any other children born to such a couple.   Something to bear in mind is that in Scotland a child can be born out of wedlock and grow up with the surname of their father which could possibly be the case here.

Annette

Annette,

Thanks very much for your sleuthing - I can now rest assured that the John Ogston (wife Isabella Sangster) was not a child of the William Ogston (from Affedes) and his wife Janet Mores (from Fraserburgh). I have been hanging onto this prospect for several months.

I also think that it may be helpful in my investigations to know that our John's occupation was provided as Woolen Weaver.

It is an interesting prospect that you pose, that George may be the illegitimate son of John and Isabella. I had not thought of this possibility - I was leaning in the direction of lack of records due to the family's possible membership in one of the Seceder religions.

I will continue my investigations - I will admit that the task is very challenging and can be frustrating. Why are first names restricted to only a few choices back then? (rhetorical question).

I thank you again for your valuable input.

Richard