John Patterson

[Sinann]

I didn't find a forge or smithy but if I'm looking in the correct place! Drum, Monaghan, Currin Civil Parish,  there is a James Rainey in the townland of Drumurcher just outside Drum with and old mill, it could possibly have been turned into a forge, I guess. It may at least be the correct spelling of her name.

[bobbyd]

Looks like the 1901 census is correct for Eliza!

I think you are onto something with #9 Boyher - My mum thought Johns father was called William and a William is at this address.
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Monaghan/Dawsongrove/Boyher/1633517/
So William could actually be Johns Brother due to the age! There's also a Martha. Now my mum said Martha was a child to John and Miss Rainee but she could actually be Williams wife. But then the other Children's names don't tie up with anyone we know. In the 1911 Census William and Martha are living at #6 Rockcorry, with a daughter Elizabeth (she's not listed in 1901). Again a name my mum said was a child to John and Miss Rainee http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Monaghan/Dawsongrove/Rockcorry_Town/806441/
What would be interesting is the wedding record for William and Martha to see if Williams father is also Thomas which would suggest William and John are brothers. Also to figure out Marthas maiden name.. I wonder if thats similar to Rainee? Does anyone have access to that record?
But the 1902 wedding record for John and Eliza said John was a widower so there must be another marriage record somewhere!

Not sure about John Patterson at #25 in 1901 as it says he's 45, whereas in 1902 he says he's 50 when he got married but as Eliza is living at #22 then that could be how they met!

Not sure about the 1901 census link you sent.

Rooney and Rainee sound very similar!

LINK to Eliza Jane Gardner on 1901 census at #22 in Boyher (Dawsongrove, Monaghan)

There is a William Patterson & family at #9 and a John Patterson at #25 in Boyher (Dawsongrove, Monaghan)

I wonder is this your John although he is shown as not married if you look at the original return there is a mismatch of columns and he could have been the widower - LINK


Also, with wrong father's name this may be unrelated
John L PATTERSON aged 27 of Riverside (F Isack)
married Feb 16 1885 in Dungannon, Co. Tyrone
Jane ROONEY aged 25 of Killymorgan (F William)

[bobbyd]

Interesting! Presume Rainey is an uncommon name in that area?

The problem with names being passed through generations is that they can get altered, like Chinese whispers, so Rainee could be something similar.

I find it very strange that there's no marriage record for John and a Rainee although we have the names of their 6 children.

It does feel as though we are getting close!!

I didn't find a forge or smithy but if I'm looking in the correct place! Drum, Monaghan, Currin Civil Parish,  there is a James Rainey in the townland of Drumurcher just outside Drum with and old mill, it could possibly have been turned into a forge, I guess. It may at least be the correct spelling of her name.

[aghadowey]

Starting with the 1901 entry for William Patterson in Boyher- it says he's born in Co. Armagh. In 1911 he's a shopkeeper in Rockcorry. He and Martha married 32 years (7 children but only 5 living).
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Monaghan/Dawsongrove/Rockcorry_Town/806441/

I find it very strange that there's no marriage record for John and a Rainee although we have the names of their 6 children.
I'm confused here as I don't recall seeing the '6 children'- can you please show me where that's been posted?

Forgetting the 'Rainee' name for a minute there is this record of a William John Pattison, son of John & Mary Anne (Madill), born 1875 Dawsongrove dist.
   https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:F5D6-4R8
Also a son Andrew born 1876 Aghadrumkeen
   https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FGD4-628
Son Thomas born 1878 Drumkeen
   https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FGF7-YX9

There's also a John Patterson and Elizabeth Daugherty having children around the same period in the area.

[myluck!]

It is difficult sometimes to work from "word of mouth" you don't want to doubt someone, or offend if you check things out but often relationships were mixed up.

Knowing that John's father was Thomas from his marriage certificate in 1902 is a fact to work from

Do you know the names of the six children from the first marriage?
Their birth records will show the name of mother and father to help locate the first marriage which may not have been in the area at all

Have you located them on the 1901 or 1911 census returns?
These could provide clues as to where they were born etc.

[bobbyd]

My apologies, the info was posted on the Belfast Forum that I mentioned In my first post.
Mum says the names of the children for John and Miss Rainee were -
- Martha, William and Elizabeth - all moved to Northern Ireland
- Alex and Robert  - moved to Australia
- Tom - moved to Canada

So perhaps William isn't related if he was born in Co Armagh, as John was born in Co Tyrone.

Thanks to everyone who has replied

[myluck!]

My apologies, the info was posted on the Belfast Forum that I mentioned In my first post.
Mum says the names of the children for John and Miss Rainee were -
- Martha, William and Elizabeth - all moved to Northern Ireland
- Alex and Robert  - moved to Australia
- Tom - moved to Canada

So perhaps William isn't related if he was born in Co Armagh, as John was born in Co Tyrone.

Thanks to everyone who has replied

Firstly you're welcome!

When you say moved to Northern Ireland I presume you mean from Monaghan rather than further afield!

Also is he supposed to have had an Alex and Robert in both marriages?
These names are included in the list of children with Eliza Jane GARDINER as well 

[aghadowey]

Rockcorry is in Cootehill PLU so if the family were living there when the children were born it might help tracing them. So, starting with what's probably the least common of the first names-

Martha Ann Patterson born 1872
   https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FY1N-QXM
Martha Ann born 1872 Drum dist.- parents John Patterson & Elizabeth Doherty
   
Martha Patterson born 1874
   https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FBM1-MYD
father probably Henry- https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:F572-7QC

Martha Elizabeth Patterson born Jan./Mar.1895
    https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FBFW-74Q

[aghadowey]

Staying with this family at the moment...

Nancy Anne Patterson, daughter of John & Elizabeth (Dougherty), born 1867-
   https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:F5KW-3YG

William Patterson, son of John & Elizabeth (Daugherty), born 1870-
   https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:F572-7QC

Martha Anne born 1872 (see previous post)

Elizabeth Patterson, daughter of John Patterson & Elizabeth Doherty, born 1875-
   https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FGZT-KMP