Holland Family Armagh

[BettyD]

Searching for the Birth of John Holland, born 1825? in Armagh Armagh. Also for the marriage of his Parents, Henry Holland ( Soldier) & Isabella Hall. The information is taken from John's Marriage Cert. to Eliza Morton (who was also born in Armagh) in Australia in 1862.

[aghadowey]

1820s is long before the start of civil registration in Ireland and quite early for some church records so you'll need to see if any records survive. Do you know what religion the family would have been in Ireland?

Civil registration of deaths started in 1864 so it's possible that John's parents could have died after that date. However, if the father was a soldier it is equally possible they moved away from Armagh or even out of Ireland sometime after John's birth.

[pah102]

I'm also interested in the Holland family you refer to. The John Holland who married Eliza Morton in 1862 is my great-grandfather. I know little of John's parents. I assume they were protestant as was John.     

[BettyD]

Hello pah102.  I cannot find proof of John Holland's (1862) Parents. The closest I have got is that he was a soldier stationed in Armagh district and that was only 2nd hand. I can find no proof of this.
did you also know John Married Margaret Macklin in 1850 in Philadelphia USA. She died in Melbourne on 27th May 1857.       Kind Regards Betty D.

[pah102]

Hi BettyD
Yes I am aware of John's first marriage ... and much more. The evidence for parents Henry and Isabella Hall is on the 1862 marriage certificate JH=EM.
The only other information I have on Henry H is as follows:
1.  On John's death certificate (Mar 1874) father Henry's rank or profession is given as farmer. So I assume that Henry was a soldier in his earlier years later becoming a farmer.
2. There were other children (John's siblings) including sister Margaret (born c 1826 in Tavana, Armagh). Margaret emigrated to Victoria in 1841 aged 15 and married a Robert Bennett from Tandragee etc, etc.
3. There may have been other siblings in Victoria in the 19th C. 
Regards pah102       

[BallyaltikilliganG]

I am unable to work out when John Holland left Co Armagh b 1825 he would be 20 at the start of the big famine.  Familysearch org has  aspecial emmigrants from the famine needs to be checked. if he had lived in Co Armagh by 20 he would have known fairly well the neighbours

Focusing on John Holland with likely connection to Co Armagh I found many head of household in the TITHE APPLOTMENT BOOKS 1823-1837  {TAB} based upon the work of the Irish Genealogy Hub’s index listing for each parish in Northern Ireland, which are quicker to lookup if you know the parish! The relevant original books are in the
Public Record Office of Northern Ireland (PRONI) Belfast. The record is known to be biased and incomplete and consists of one inc name, quantity & quality of land, all for tax purposes. Its value is it locates by townland and if any family continued to live there, then about 30 years later ie 1860s they may be traceable to map references showing blg and boundaries of fields etc. in Griffiths valuation. all this helps towards finding which church they may have belonged to and so surviving church records can be searched

John Holland m1 Margaret Macklin
Macklin are found in theses Co Armagh civil parishes with no of entries in brackets
CLONFEACLE (4) DERRYNOOSE(7) GRANGE(1) TYNAN (4)
about 25-30 years later Macklin are still in these parishes in Griffiths Valuation plus KEADY (1)and TYNAN{1}

John Holland m2 Eliza Morton
Holland with Morton living in the same Co Armagh civil parish ie I have filtered out many entries
Holland, Michl.    Townland: Donamoney Y: 1833   Clonfeacle   Armagh 1828-33
Morton, William    Townland: Drummond Y: 1833—Clonfeacle   Armagh 1828-33
Holland, Michl.    Townland: Donamoney Y: 1833   Clonfeacle   Armagh 1828-33
Morton, William    Townland: Drummond Y: 1833—Clonfeacle   Armagh 1828-33

Holland   Owen      Clonalig      Creggan      Armagh1860's
Morton   James      Crossmaglen    Dundalk Street Creggan   Armagh1860's

Holland, James    Townland: Tullyhappy Year: 1835   Killevy      Armagh1828-33
Morton, William        Townland: Drumbanagher Year: 1835-Killevy   Armagh1828-33
Morton   Thomas   Drumbanagher   Killevy      Armagh1860's
Morton   William   Drumbanagher   Killevy      Armagh1860's
Morton   Thomas   Killybodagh      Killevy      Armagh1860's
Holland   George   Serse         Killevy      Armagh1860's

Holland, William    Townland: Ahory Year: 1833   Kilmore   Armagh1828-33
Holland, Samuel    Townland: Lisavague Year: 1833   Kilmore   Armagh 1828-33
Holland, John    Townland: Toneyvalton Year: 1833   Kilmore   Armagh1828-33
Morton, Mary    Townland: Richhill Tenements Year: 1833-Kilmore   Armagh 1828-33
there are no Mortons in 1860’s
Morton   Mary Jane   Armaghbrague   Lisnadill   Armagh   1860's
Holland   John      Ballyheridan      Lisnadill   Armagh   1860's

Holland, George    Townland : Turkerry Year : 1828   Loughgall   Armagh1828-33
Holland, James    Townland : Turkerry Year : 1828   Loughgall   Armagh1828-33
Holland, Thomas    Townland : Turkerry Year : 1828   Loughgall   Armagh1828-33
Morton, Rev. John    Townland : Liveleglish Year : 1828   Loughgall   Armagh1828-33
Morton Terence   Ardress, West.         Loughgall   Armagh1860's
Holland James   Turcarra            Loughgall   Armagh1860's
Holland   Thomas   Turcarra         Loughgall   Armagh 1860's
that reduces a blind search of 28 parishes by about 75% down to 7 or 8 much more likely parishes

sources
1823-1837 Tithes Applotment Books based upon the online index work of the Irish Genealogy Hub’s listing for each parish in Northern Ireland, I have made an index to their entries.   The relevant original books are in the Public Record Office of Northern Ireland (PRONI) Belfast
1863 Griffiths Valuation three sources
1. https://www.failteromhat.com for quick index. 
2. http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/ for detail and map ref ..
3. https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/information-and-services/search-archives-online/valuation-revision-books since 1863

one could do the same for Hall and Holland or just the entries for John Holland

last try church record https://www.irishgenealogy.ie/en/ 

have run out of time
hope thought provoking Good luck onwards

[pah102]

In reply to Bally..G post of 21.12.19:

JH = Margaret Macklin. Margaret Macklin was a daughter of Andrew Macklin, blacksmith of Newtownstewart, County Tyrone and his wife Anne (Love). Margaret was not from County Armagh. John and Margaret married in 1850 in Philadelphia USA. They travelled to Victoria in 1852. Margaret died in Melbourne in 1857 after a 'protracted illness'(TB). 

JH = Eliza Morton. Eliza Morton was the third daughter of Charles Morton and his wife Sarah Rice (Gibson). The Mortons were from Cormeen Rd, Killylea, Armagh. The Mortons emigrated to Victoria in 1853. John and Eliza were married at Flemington in 1862. The family lived in Victoria 1862-74. John died in Brunswick, Melbourne in 1874. John and Eliza did not live together in Armagh.

John's younger sister Margaret (born 1826) emigrated to the Port Phillip District (Melbourne) in 1841. So, I think that it is more than likely that John left Armagh before 1845 when presumably he travelled to North America.

I would be very surprised if John had some connection to the land in Armagh ie, if he was one of the John Hollands you have identified in the TAB records. John was a victualler in Philidelphia and he continued that occupation (as victualler/licensed victualler/hotel keeper) in Victoria. John gave his place of birth/where from as Armagh, and in one instance, Tandragee. Sister Margaret gave her place of birth as Tavana. So I assume that John's parents (Henry Holland = Isabella Hall) lived in or near Tandragee/Tavana in the mid-1820's. I understand that Henry was a soldier. One record (given by John's brother-in-law J J Garland at the time of John's death in 1874) gave father Henry's occupation as farmer. So it is possible that Henry Holland may be on the TAB records.     
           

[BallyaltikilliganG]

the only Henry Holland i could find in the tithes is
Holland, H.-Townland: Dungannon Gardens Y: 1832-Drumglass-Tyrone
the address nowdays sounds more like a city address, over to you

[aghadowey]

the only Henry Holland i could find in the tithes is
Holland, H.-Townland: Dungannon Gardens Y: 1832-Drumglass-Tyrone
the address nowdays sounds more like a city address, over to you

https://www.cotyroneireland.com/tithe/drumglass.html gives as in townland of Drumcoo.
https://www.townlands.ie/tyrone/dungannon-middle/drumglass/drumcoo/