Author Topic: MIdlothian, Perth & Roxburghshire: Thomas FORREST, born c1830, Edinburgh  (Read 1190 times)

Offline BAC3

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Hello,

Thomas FORREST was born c1830, West Calder, Edinburgh, the son of James FORREST and his wife Janet (nee ROBERTSON).   On 20/04/1845 he was sentenced to transportation for 7 years for Housbreaking but pardoned on 25/09/1847.  At his conviction he stated his father, James FORREST, was a Tailor or Sailor (bad transcription) and lived at Camel's Close, Cannongate, Edinburgh.

On 01/10/1862 he re-offended, was tried at Perth for theft and sentenced to 8 years penal servitude.  The prison records state he was occupied as a Hawker and married with one child (see later).

Next sighting is April 1881 and he is now living in Hawick, Roxburghshire, and working as a Licensed Hawker.   He is living with Mary McMANNERS (GALLACHER) and two children......is this the wife referred to above?

I apologise if the details are a little sketchy but I hope someone can make a connection confirming that I am concerned with one and the same Thomas FORREST ???

For the moment and thank you

BAC3





Offline AMBLY

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Re: MIdlothian, Perth & Roxburghshire: Thomas FORREST, born c1830, Edinburgh
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 27 August 16 01:42 BST (UK) »
Hi BAC3,

If the Thomas FORREST in 1881 with Mary GALLACHER/McMANNERS is 'your' Thomas, it seems quite unlikely to me,  that she is the mother of any child he might have had in 1862 at the time of his trial.

Mary was producing children with her husband James GALLOCHER / GALAGHER between 1860 and 1870, though by 1871 James has possibly either disappeared or died:

   1861: 6 Kirkgate, Hawick, Roxburgshire
   https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:VB7C-RQ4
   Ref: Parish 789 /  ED 7/ Pg 3 / HS 14
   Head: James GALLACHER 24, Hawker, b Ireland
   Wife: Mary GALLACHER 21, Hawker, b Hawick
   Dau: Catherine GALLACHER 6  mths, b Hawick
   
   1871:  6 Howegate, Hawick, Roxburgshire
        (not EGSETER  A*y,  ;)
        https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:VBL1-L5R
   Ref: Parish 789 /ED 7 / Pg 16 / HS 83
   Head: Mary GALLOCHER 30,  Hawker, b Hawick
   Dau: Catherine GALLOCHER 10, Scholar, b Hawick (not Isabella A*y,  ;)
   Dau: Mary GALLOCHER 6, Scholar, b Hawick
   Dau: Sarah GALLOCHER 2, b Hawick
   Son: John GALLOCHER 6 mths, b Hawick
   Father-In-Law: John McMANUS 69,(occ)------------?, b Ireland
   Boarder: James DUSS?? 50, Tailor Journeyman, b Dundee
       

From Family Search - BIRTHS:
   
   Father: James GALLACHER (GALAGHER)
   Mother: Mary McMANNUS
   All Born Hawick Roxburgshire:
   Catherine GALAGHAR b 11 Jul 1860
   Sarah GALAGHER, b 26 Jan 1862
   James GALLACHER b 17 Dec 1863
   Mary GALAGHER, b 27 Mar 1865
   James GALAGHER b 26 Oct 1866
   Sarah GALAGHER b 26 Oct 1868
        John GALAGHER b 13 Oct 1870.

The 1881 Census in full, is more interesting, as it  indicates Mary is the mother of a FORREST child born 1873/74 in England - Thomas' child?

   CENSUS 1881: 7 Round Close, Hawick Roxburgshire
   Parish 789/ ED17 /Pg 24/ HS 95
   Head: Mary McMANNERS or GALLACHER 40, licensed Hawker (small wares) b Hawick
   Dau: Catherine GALLACHER 20, Licensed Hawker, b Hawick
   Dau: Mary GALLACHER 16, Licensed Hawker, b Hawick
   Dau: Sarah GALLACHER 12, School, b Hawick
   Son: Thomas FORREST 7, School, b Borgland, Northumberland
   Gr-Dau: Mary GALLACHER 2 , b Hawick
   Boarder: Thomas FORREST 51, licensed Hawker (small wares) b West Calder, Midlothian
   
Unsure about 'Borgland' but  FreeBMD has 2 possible birth Rego:
Dec Qtr 1873: Thomas FORREST, reg: Bellingham 10b, pg 312
Dec Qtr 1874: Thomas FORREST, reg: Berwick 10b, pg 411

Of the two, I think the Bellingham one more likley. As the Berwick one seems to be on Census in England (parents are English, and named Thomas & Mary Ann).

However, there are a number of Thomas GALLAGHER (& var) Birth regos in Northumberland too, which could be him.

Cheers
AMBLY
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

"Now that we're all here, I'm not sure if we're all there...."

 Entre los individuos, como entre las naciones, el respeto al derecho ajeno es la paz
 Among individuals, as among nations, respect for the rights of others is peace
    ~Benito Juarez (1806-1872)

Offline AMBLY

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Re: MIdlothian, Perth & Roxburghshire: Thomas FORREST, born c1830, Edinburgh
« Reply #2 on: Saturday 27 August 16 02:18 BST (UK) »
CENSUS 1891: 7 Round Close, Hawick Roxburgshire
   Ref: Parish 789/  ED1 / Pg 26/ HS 112
   Head: Mary GALLACHER,50  Hawker
   Boarder: Thomas FORREST, 61, Hawker
   
   The son Thomas FORREST, might be this one in
   1891: Wellington Reformatory Farm School, Pencuick, Midlothian
   Ref: Parish 697 / Pg 3/ HS1
   Thomas FORREST 17, Scholar, b England
   
This looks like Mary in 1901, on her own still in Hawick.
CENSUS 1901: 4 Tannage Close, Hawick , Roxburgshire
   Ref: Parish 789 ED1 / Pg30 / HS 177
   Head: Mary GALACHER 62, Small Drapery Hawker, b Hawick
   
   And son Thomas FORREST, might be this one:
   1901: Carlisle Rd (caravan) (near To Lady Ann's Cott), New Monkland, Lanarkshire
   Parish: 651, ED17/ pg 16 / HS73
   Head: Thomas FORREST 28, Hawker, b England
   Wife: Christina FORREST 27, Hawker, b England
   Son: Thomas FORREST 4, b Stenhousemuir, Stirlingshire
   
Would be looking for first: :
   
Death of Thomas FORREST  (b abt 1830)i n Hawick between 1891 and 1901, to see who his parents may be. Who informant was. And who any wife might have been.
   
Birth of Thomas FORREST in 1873/74 Northumberland, to see who his parents are listed as.

Cheers
AMBLY

The Bellingham Thomas, might have a WW1 record - just having a look now....

Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

"Now that we're all here, I'm not sure if we're all there...."

 Entre los individuos, como entre las naciones, el respeto al derecho ajeno es la paz
 Among individuals, as among nations, respect for the rights of others is peace
    ~Benito Juarez (1806-1872)

Offline AMBLY

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Re: MIdlothian, Perth & Roxburghshire: Thomas FORREST, born c1830, Edinburgh
« Reply #3 on: Saturday 27 August 16 02:33 BST (UK) »
The Thomas FORREST b Bellingham abt 1873 who is in WW1 records (Scots Fusiliers):
(https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QVBL-Z77X

In 1901, this Thomas has a wife named Margaret & 3 children age 4, 2 and 6mths;  and lives in Lasswade, Midlothian, a Coal Miner.

If it became a probability that your Thomas FORREST b 1830 is the man who seemingly had a child born in Bellingham area by Mary GALLACHER/MsMANNUS - then the marriage record of this Thomas to Margaret (who was b Lanarkshire) should determine his parents for purposes of inclusion or elimination  :)

Cheers
AMBLY
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

"Now that we're all here, I'm not sure if we're all there...."

 Entre los individuos, como entre las naciones, el respeto al derecho ajeno es la paz
 Among individuals, as among nations, respect for the rights of others is peace
    ~Benito Juarez (1806-1872)


Offline BAC3

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Re: MIdlothian, Perth & Roxburghshire: Thomas FORREST, born c1830, Edinburgh
« Reply #4 on: Saturday 27 August 16 10:19 BST (UK) »
Ambly,

Good Morning and my thanks and gratitude for all your research.

I shall now delight in tackling the jigsaw......there are so many pieces ::).......but the overall opinion I gleaned from your information, at a glance so to speak, is that you may have provided the answer.   I will let you know later today hopefully.  The one area I have not yet managed to understand completely is his second period of servitude and the various transfers involved, Wakefield and Chatham, for instance, and then his eventual release ???.

Once again my thanks

BAC3

Offline ev

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Re: MIdlothian, Perth & Roxburghshire: Thomas FORREST, born c1830, Edinburgh
« Reply #5 on: Saturday 27 August 16 12:01 BST (UK) »
Quote
At his conviction he stated his father, James FORREST, was a Tailor or Sailor (bad transcription) and lived at Camel's Close, Cannongate, Edinburgh.

Looking at the 1845 precognition record(National Records of Scotland) maybe
Quote
Thomas Forrest, son of James Forrest, porter, Address: Campbell's Close, Canongate, Edinburgh
AD14/45/316


ev
Census information Crown copyright , All Census information from transcriptions - check original records , Familysearch/IGI is a finding tool only - check original records

Offline BAC3

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Re: MIdlothian, Perth & Roxburghshire: Thomas FORREST, born c1830, Edinburgh
« Reply #6 on: Saturday 27 August 16 12:13 BST (UK) »
Ambly,

Oh dear :'(...........I have hit a snag, but possibly another piece of the jigsaw.

I mentioned not understanding completely his second term of servitude but now I have probably resolved the problem.   He was transported to Western Australia aboard the Clara, arriving Fremantle 13/04/1864.   He was given his Certificate of Freedom on 07/01/1871 at Bunbury and during the previous 7 years had worked as a Labourer, General Servant, Splitter, "Worked for self 1870" (unspecified), his known areas Fremantle and Wellington.

He almost certainly re-appears in the UK before the 1881 Census (the profile is so close a resemblance!!), and other than the birth of Thomas in 1873/1874 (could he be the father??) which adds that modicum of doubt, I need to ascertain details of when he left WA.

I feel thoroughly justified in feeling I have the right person as the information you retrieved provides a perfect scenario into which he fits ::)

Take care

BAC3

Offline BAC3

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Re: MIdlothian, Perth & Roxburghshire: Thomas FORREST, born c1830, Edinburgh
« Reply #7 on: Saturday 27 August 16 12:19 BST (UK) »
ev,

Thank you.

The transcription errors seemed to have affected Campbell's Close too in favour of Camel's Close!!
Otherwise Porter, Sailor, Tailor.....?

BAC3